Ipswich Unemployed Action.

Campaigning for Unemployed Rights.

“Social security allowances have hit their lowest relative levels since the creation of the welfare state.”

with 105 comments

Image result for universal credit failure"

Underlying Crisis is Big Drop in Payment Levels.

“This paper will argue that it is time to embrace a more progressive vision of social security in the 21st century. Fundamentally, it would recognise that, in the world’s fifth richest country, a basic minimum standard of living should be a foundation for citizenship. This idea must sit at the heart of the social security system.”

Universal Credit and social security payments have fallen to just 12.5% of average earnings, think tank says

The ‘I’, the paper that many of us buy.

Just out….

 

Universal Credit payments have fallen to just 12.5 per cent of average earnings, the think tank IPPR has reported.

Social security allowances have hit their lowest relative levels since the creation of the welfare state, according to the group’s report.

Universal Credit payments have fallen to just 12.5 per cent of average earnings, the think tank IPPR has reported.

Social security allowances have hit their lowest relative levels since the creation of the welfare state, according to the group’s report.

Real time spending its lowest since the system began, according to the “Social (in)security” report.

As a share of the gross domestic product (GDP) – the total value of goods produced and services provided in a country during one year – spending has fallen from 47 per cent to 40 per cent, and is set to be 3.9 per cent lower in real terms by 2021/22 than it was in 2010/11, amounting to £37bn less being spent on working-age social security.

The IPPR say the calculations issue a stark warning.

It believes the government needs to invest at least £8.4bn into the system to keep it afloat.

“Social security should offer a safety net, not a tightrope over poverty,” said Clare McNeil, the associate director of the IPPR.

“It is remarkable that in postwar Britain the support for those living in poverty was closer to average earnings than it is today. This is the very simple fact that lies behind the record levels of personal debt, rising use of food banks and increasing destitution that we see in the UK.”

These conclusions will come as no surprise to contributors to this Blog.

The Report from the IPPR.

Social (in)security: Reforming the UK’s social safety net

The UK has experienced a decade of austerity. While this has not resulted in a dramatic decrease in public spending in absolute terms, it does represent the longest pause in real-terms spending growth on record. Moreover, with the UK’s population continuing to grow, spending per head has fallen, and is set to be 3.9 per cent lower in real terms by 2021/22 than it was in 2010/11. Likewise, as a share of GDP, spending has fallen from 47 per cent to 40 per cent.

This reduction in spending on social security has occurred at the same time as fundamental reform to how working age benefits operate in the UK, with the introduction of universal credit, which aimed to encourage more people into work and simplify the system, thereby reducing fraud, error, confusion and administration costs.

However, it is far from clear that this has been the result. Moreover, across a whole host of other metrics, social indicators show that our welfare system is failing to deliver as we would expect it to. Having declined significantly during the first decade of the century, poverty is now growing again, particularly amongst pensioners, children and those in-work. 

This paper will argue that it is time to embrace a more progressive vision of social security in the 21st century. Fundamentally, it would recognise that, in the world’s fifth richest country, a basic minimum standard of living should be a foundation for citizenship. This idea must sit at the heart of the social security system.

Written by Andrew Coates

November 18, 2019 at 5:41 pm

105 Responses

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  1. Reblogged this on BertieS.

    AnnoyedIrishMan

    November 18, 2019 at 6:16 pm

  2. Thankfully the Labour party have a trial of Basic Income in their Manifesto and have already stated that they will phase out Universal Credit, so vote Labour.

    trev

    November 18, 2019 at 6:38 pm

    • If Labour can’t do better in the polls than they are currently doing it won’t happen. Why has it got to be so lukewarm all the time ? Why do they always look like some kind of B Team ?

      Tom Sutton

      November 18, 2019 at 7:04 pm

      • @ Tom

        That’s your opinion, it depends which polls, blogs and newspapers you choose to read or believe. The Tories aren’t looking too clever and neither are the LibDems, depending upon one’s viewpoint, status and regional location. It’s all up for grabs and the only way to stop the Tories is by voting Labour, so it’s up to you, or you can continue trying to undermine Labour’s chances by constantly posting negative comments.

        trev

        November 18, 2019 at 7:37 pm

      • You shouldn’t be changing your vote based on the polls. Just to be on the ‘winning side’. These are the same polls that predicted a Neil Kinnock landslide and a resounding defeat for Tony Blair. Polls get it drastically wrong. Polls are used to sway public opinion. Have the courage to vote with your heart rather than voting for whoever the polls says are going to win. There is only ONE poll that counts (subject to ‘confirmatory) a people’s vote) and that is on the 12th December 2019.

        U Don't Gov (some1 else does)

        November 19, 2019 at 10:19 am

      • @ trev

        Sorry, mate, but Labour looks set not only to lose the next general election but end up with dozens fewer seats and therefore much less influence in the next parliament. I don’t know which newspapers and/or media you’ve been reading but everything reputable that I’ve seen says that the Tories WILL win a a majority and have free reign until the next parliament ends. Collated statistics all say pretty much the same thing: Many of Labour’s policies are popular but Jeremy Corbyn and a good number in his shadow cabinet are not. Prepare yourself to be disappointed and brace yourself for up to FIVE YEARS of a Boris Johnson premiership.

        Statto

        November 19, 2019 at 10:30 am

      • @ Statto

        So based on that you’re going to vote Tory then? I don’t care what any polls say, I will vote Labour and urge others to do likewise.

        trev

        November 19, 2019 at 10:39 am

      • You have to wonder why the media give so much coverage to deeply unpopular characters such as Corbyn, McDonnell and Abbott. Labour needs a new broom if it is to stand any chance of being elected to power.

        D Abbott

        November 19, 2019 at 11:41 am

      • It’s the msm and Right wing media that try their damnedest to make them unpopular by misrepresenting them through biased reporting. Example; Michael Foot pilloried for allegedly wearing a “donkey jacket” on Rememberance Day at the Cenotaph when he did no such thing, compared with Boris laying a wreath upside-down which was edited out by the BBC who replaced that shot with footage of him from 2016. I would suggest you use your brain when watching tv or reading news reports.

        trev

        November 19, 2019 at 12:20 pm

      • @ trev

        Where did I say that I was not going to vote Labour? Nobody tells me how to vote and I think that most people are independently minded to follow in my footsteps as far as voting is concerned. A lot of voters are tribal and always vote for the same party and can’t be won over to support another party but all of the polls are saying that Jeremy Corbyn has failed to generate enough support from floating voters willing to switch from one party to another, people in marginal seats that might switch to Labour despite voting for other parties previously, to gain enough MPs to get Labour into government. (In fact it’s worse than that with predictions of Labour losing seats rather than gaining them.) That is what ALL the statistics, psephology and expert analysis is registering. It’s not about people being told who to vote for it’s mostly about Jeremy Corbyn personally not appealing to a big enough demographic to lead a political party to victory.

        I am sad about this but have accepted that is the way things have panned out this time around.

        Anyway, pal, only a month or so to go and we’ll find out by means of the only poll that matters, i.e., the results of the up and coming general election. Nothing would please me more to be proved wrong but I think that is about as likely as the second coming of the son of God.

        Statto

        November 19, 2019 at 1:24 pm

      • Oh well, perhaps that’s the difference between you and me, I DO expect and anticipate the Second Coming of the Son of God. As for Labour I just think that it pays to remain positive and not pay attention to negativity from the sidelines. Labour has just as much chance as the Tories, more chance if the general public were better informed, but the opinion polls and biased political commentary won’t prevent me from voting Labour as there really is no alternative. Things are bad enough now but if the Tories do manage to get in again then it will be the end of life as we know it.

        trev

        November 19, 2019 at 1:32 pm

      • @Tom. I Agree, Presentation has not been a Labour strongpoint.. I don’t know why but they always look as if they are struggling to get their ideas across. It looks confused and uncertain.

        John Kendall

        November 19, 2019 at 2:10 pm

  3. It’s just systematic cruelty from the Tories, and you notice how they have not offered a penny more than the 1.7 % increase that was already due in 2020. This is next to nothing, because they just don’t care.

    Alan Turner

    November 18, 2019 at 6:59 pm

  4. The modern Conservatives really don’t care in the least about the poor and the struggling, most of who don’t vote for them, and will only address the UK’s failing social security system if they begin to suffer political damage and embarrassment because of this neglect. The Tories today, at least the ones in government anyway, really are the scum of the earth who happily redistributed wealth from the poor to the better off and brazenly threw the needy and the struggling under the bus to gather the money to do it and they will carry on doing it until the public can no longer bear it.

    Ash

    November 18, 2019 at 7:11 pm

    • What you are forgetting though is that once you make people better off they turn around and vote Tory. It is human nature, And there is no getting away from human nature Making people better off is self-defeating. We are ALL Tories at heart.

      The Lion Queen

      November 19, 2019 at 10:13 am

      • “We are all Tories at heart”…I beg to differ! I am not, and never will be, a Tory at heart. Tory ideology is obscene, it goes against everything I believe in, it is the politics of psychopaths and sociopaths.

        trev

        November 19, 2019 at 10:36 am

      • Based on my own experience I know that people are better than that and I am certainly NOT a Tory at heart or in any other way, shape or form. Humanity is better than that. Just look at how much money is given privately and voluntarily to charity and good causes by our own citizens every moment of every day. I see unrewarded acts of kindness whenever and wherever I look. You’re wrong, ever so wrong, I am glad to say and probably need to get out more.

        Landry

        November 19, 2019 at 10:37 am

      • I beg to differ! My aunt and uncle when they bought their council house the first thing they did was to join the Conservative Club. These were dyed in the wool-cloth capped socialists mind you. They also took on the most ridiculous sounding plummy accents. But the most despicable thing they did was take up fox-hunting. There is nowt funnier and folk as we say in Yorkshire. You really should get out more.

        Yorkshire Lass

        November 19, 2019 at 11:25 am

      • Well if that’s true it would certainly never happen to me I can absolutely assure you. Speaking as someone who has been a vegetarian for 48 years, and is passionate about animal rights, I would not take up any form of blood sports no matter how rich I was. If I won the lottery I would make large donations to animal charities and organizations such as the League Against Cruel Sports and Peta, etc. Furthermore, I have never stepped foot in a Conservative club in my life and never will do (unless as part of a Riot perhaps). As for Council Houses, I grew up in one, and my Socialist parents flatly refused to buy it as it went against their principles. And yes I’m a (flat cap wearing)Working Class Yorkshireman born and bred.

        trev

        November 19, 2019 at 12:12 pm

      • There is nowt funnier than folk as we say in Yorkshire.

        Yorkshire Lass

        November 19, 2019 at 11:27 am

      • For the Fox Hunting Toffs and their Cloth Cap followers who want to bring the Suffolk and Essex Hunt to Ipswich parks this is the ideal candidate who’s got his priorities right.

        Andrew Coates

        November 19, 2019 at 11:44 am

      • @Lion Queen- Sadly this is often the case. Once people get on the property ladder and get a bit of money behind them, so often they start going Tory. And also as they get older, many people tend to get more conservative in their views.

        Rob H.

        November 19, 2019 at 2:05 pm

  5. Reblogged this on Tory Britain!.

    A6er

    November 19, 2019 at 9:56 am

    • Too true Trev we’re not all Tories at heart. I use to be a Socialist. Now I’m an anarchist. But have finally decided to vote Labour. I’m still not impressed with that dreadful mural but I actually agree with a lot else they’re promising…..

      katrehman

      November 19, 2019 at 2:45 pm

      • Glad to hear it Kat, when we’re faced with Boris & Co. there’s no option but Labour. If the Tories succeed I dread to think what will happen – the NHS privatised and flogged to America, poverty will increase beyond what the foodbanks can cope with, millions unable to afford healthcare or food, homeless and suicides will rise, we’ll be tripping over bodies in the streets. I’m not sure which mural you’re referring to though?

        trev

        November 19, 2019 at 3:29 pm

  6. Holy smoke! Electoral Calculus has the CONS back up at a 76 MAJORITY. Yesterday they were down to a mere 50.

    Probability of possible outcomes:
    Conservative majority 66%
    Labour majority 8%

    https://www.electoralcalculus.co.uk/homepage.html

    Batwoman

    November 19, 2019 at 11:36 am

    • @Batwoman- It’s like watching a slow-motion car crash. Oh God, Oh Corbyn…

      I Was A Labour Voter

      November 19, 2019 at 2:00 pm

  7. Andrew Coates

    November 19, 2019 at 1:13 pm

  8. Anyone on here already heard about the death of a 65-year-old “fit-for-work” Jobseeker in Wales?

    Report here:

    https://morningstaronline.co.uk/article/b/man-dies-job-centre-assessment-ban

    Grim Reaper

    November 19, 2019 at 1:34 pm

  9. @trev – You believe in the Second Coming ? How can you expect anyone to take your opinions seriously if you come out with stuff like this ?

    Andrew Atheist

    November 19, 2019 at 1:56 pm

    • @ Andrew Atheist

      My Religious / Spiritual beliefs are my own affair and I only mentioned that in reply to a particular comment that brought up the subject. My Religious beliefs are my Right, and I don’t have to justify them to you or anyone else.

      trev

      November 19, 2019 at 2:25 pm

  10. Just an idea, but if Universal Credit is at 12.5 % of average earnings, why not put it up to 50 % of average earnings ? That would be a simple way to stop a lot of this poverty.

    Moser Roth

    November 19, 2019 at 2:15 pm

    • Also if we equalise the school leaving age with the retirement age we banish unemployment forever with the stroke of a pen.

      Djinn and Tonic

      November 19, 2019 at 5:54 pm

      • They should have brought State Pension age down to 60 for both men and women. In Ireland if you’re unemployed and reach age 63 you only have to sign on annually from then onwards and are exempt from doing any job search or attending any schemes and courses. The unemployed in Ireland also receive the equivalent of £165 per week. Unemployment Benefits system in the UK is barbaric by comparison and is miles behind.

        trev

        November 19, 2019 at 6:29 pm

      • @Djinn and Tonic – that is an idea of surpassing brilliance !

        Julian Chalmers

        November 19, 2019 at 10:58 pm

      • In P****ol****and when you reach 50 they retire you and put you on P*****olish the equivalent of unemployment benefits. Why can’t the DWP not just ‘retire’ the unemployed and leave them to their own devices. And get rid of those monstrosities called ‘Jobcentres’ that blight out High Streets? Are they frightened that someone, somewhere might earn a couple of shillings ‘on the side’?

        Fagin

        November 20, 2019 at 10:10 am

      • Not sure if it is still the same but back in the day you ‘signed on’ at the Post Office when you cashed your Giro cheque,

        Irish Rose

        November 20, 2019 at 10:16 am

      • I’m talking about Eire, Southern Ireland here just to be clear.

        Irish Rose

        November 20, 2019 at 10:18 am

  11. @ Foxhunting – I can tell you it’s no fun running for your life, chased by a pack of hounds. Knowing that if they catch you you’ll be torn to bits.

    Freddy Fox

    November 19, 2019 at 2:19 pm

  12. Isn’t now a bad time to have this TV debate between Johnson and Corbyn ? After what just happened to Prince Andrew ? Labour have got so much riding on this. But if Corbyn makes a pig’s ear of this, on TV, the damage to Labour is going to be terminal. Why risk it ?

    Lawrence G.

    November 19, 2019 at 2:55 pm

    • I’m not a fan of these TV debates myself, it’s all a bit too American and only really appeals to the Strictly Come Bake Off Coronation Street-watching masses, many of whom are uneducated, Politically illiterate, gullible and Reactionary, and that of course is the real problem. The Sun reading Joe Public may be swayed by this nonsense.

      trev

      November 19, 2019 at 3:23 pm

      • @trev . I don’t trust Johnson on this at all. He must think he can win, despite all the bad publicity over poverty and austerity.

        Sarah

        November 19, 2019 at 4:20 pm

      • Johnson is a liar who tries to bluff and fluff his way out of difficult questions by going into his bumbling Boris act, hopefully he’ll put his foot in his mouth and come unstuck against Jeremy Corbyn’s integrity and considered approach.

        trev

        November 19, 2019 at 4:27 pm

      • Corbyn should ask Johnson whether food poverty and food bank usage would be higher or lower at the end of the next parliament if he were to remain Prime Minister. He can’t really admit that it would be higher and so would have to answer lower, an implicit undertaking that he could be held accountable for from that point onward.

        Kinky

        November 19, 2019 at 5:10 pm

      • Good point. I’ve just emailed the Director of my local foodbank to ask if she knows anything about planned migration from legacy Benefits to UC in the new year, as that’s what I’ve been told by the tutor of an Interserve course that I’m currently attending. This tutor is well-in with the Jobcentre and works closely with them and says she has information to that effect, but the Jobcentre haven’t told us anything yet. The foodbank are also well connected and in the loop with the Council and the local Jobcentre so they should know, and would need to be informed if they are to expect a big influx of new clients in the new year, not that the situation isn’t bad enough already. But according to the Interserve woman everyone in the class is to be transferred to Universal Credit in January, so naturally we are all very worried.
        UC was introduced in my area on a limited basis two years ago, for new claims and changes in circumstances only, but even that has resulted in a 300% increase in foodbank referrals in my town.

        trev

        November 19, 2019 at 5:42 pm

      • http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukdsi/2019/9780111178317/contents

        it is not in law yet so as ever the provider is talking out there ass.

        DWP’s intention is to take remaining tax credit claimants (and other legacy benefit claimants) through the managed migration process between November 2020 and December 2023.

        https://revenuebenefits.org.uk/universal-credit/guidance/existing-tax-credit-claimants/managed-migration/#when%20will%20managed%20migration%20happen

        superted

        November 19, 2019 at 6:40 pm

      • Thanks superted, that is a massive relief!!! I suspected that she was bullshiting but yet she was so adamant that it was convincing, combined with the fact that the Jobcentre are sending all the staff on UC training and are in the process of recruiting for extra Work Roaches, I was getting really worried, we all are, there’s 10 of us on this course all still on JSA. Thanks again, I’ll pass on the good news to the rest of them in the morning.

        trev

        November 19, 2019 at 6:52 pm

      • http://data.parliament.uk/DepositedPapers/Files/DEP2019-0465/Non_digital_relationships_v1.0.pdf

        https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/non_digital_uc_claim

        now if they migrate all of us to uc we wont have a digital claim no uc account/email or journal and they can not force you to make a claim online either.

        so when the time does come i doubt very little will change just dont give the dwp a email address and there screwed.

        DSC_0030_02

        superted

        November 19, 2019 at 7:09 pm

      • Changing from phone to online claim
        Phone claims should be regularly reviewed with the claimant by both work coaches and case managers. They should ensure this i s still the most
        appropriate channel for them to manage their claim.
        If a claimant attains the skills and support to manage a claim online take the following action:
         access the ‘Change from phone claim to online’ ALP which is held in the resources area of Universal Learning. Complete the fi rst two sections of
        this ALP
         generate a ‘Change from phone claim to online’ to-do. This is only available to cases flagged as phone claims and only when the claimant’s identity
        has been verified
         this sends a link to the claimant’s email address for them to set a password. The service sets a user name
        The claimant will then be able to manage their claim online, and see any journal entries previously made.
        This process should be completed face to face and only exceptionally over the phone.

        and thats the reason i bet they keep asking for a email address 😉 😉

        superted

        November 19, 2019 at 7:31 pm

      • I don’t recall them asking for my email address but they did fairly recently ask for a copy of my CV and that contains my email address, so I guess they already have it now, unless my CV has disappeared into some file or folder never to be seen again and totally forgotten about.

        trev

        November 19, 2019 at 7:53 pm

      • tbh they have never kept a copy of my paper cv but they could have logged the email address on the lms so have a record of it.

        if they do have a record of it you can ask for it to be deleted from the lms as it is your data to control but you can always say it is no longer used but i bet they will ask you for the new one.

        superted

        November 19, 2019 at 8:03 pm

    • Just detected some bias there in the TV debate, that woman (whoever she is) asked: “Do you have a magic money tree Mr. Johnson? and do you perhaps have more than one magic money tree Mr. Corbyn?”. Unfair bias considering that Labour’s figures add up and the Tories’ don’t.

      trev

      November 19, 2019 at 8:52 pm

  13. @trev – Sounds to me like the providers are looking to transfer their own claimants over to Universal Credit early. Unless it’s to earn some sort of brownie points from the DWP ? As in the claimants have finished the course, and here they are all wrapped up for you and ready to work, and on Universal Credit ?
    Also of course, it is the financial interests of the provider to push as many people onto UC as they can. They are paid by results, and even though UC jobs are usually crap and short-term, the providers will get a payment as soon as some poor devil is forced into a dead-end job.
    If they have bullshitted you onto a voluntary course, they may well feel they can simply dominate the situation further by ‘volunteering’ you for an early transfer to Universal Credit. How many people have you seen over the years who just give up, and go along with things for a quiet life ?
    As @superted says, don’t do it.

    Alan Turner

    November 19, 2019 at 9:51 pm

    • I really don’t know what she’s playing at, whether it’s scare tactics or misinformation on her part, but there’s no way I would volunteer to be transferred to UC, dragged kicking and screaming more like.

      Funnily enough a similar thing happened about 3 years ago on another employability skills course called Skills Conditionality’, run by a provider called Pinnacle People. The tutor on that course attempted to frighten us into being employable by saying that if we didn’t get a job we’d all be put on the mandatory Community Work Programme, until I told her that the funding had been withdrawn and the programme had been cancelled and that there would be no more referrals to it. You should have seen the look on her face, she didn’t even believe me at first but when she found out I was right she quit her job and was gone within a week, having been under the impression that the Community Work programme was going to keep herself and the shitty company she worked for in lucrative business for the foreseeable future. Ha ha 😂

      trev

      November 19, 2019 at 10:06 pm

      • @trev – I’d be cautious there Trev, sounds like you have got one of the over-zealous Work Coaches.
        Show any weakness here and you will be put onto UC before you know it. It wouldn’t suprise me if there was some sort of target for the provider to see how many people they can get to go on it.

        Rob

        November 19, 2019 at 10:51 pm

      • The tutor has also got a bee in her bonnet about referring 3 of us on to a self-employment course to start up your own business. She has only mentioned it briefly and not discussed it properly with any of us or provided us with any details. I said straight away that I don’t have an idea for a business but she didn’t listen. What I haven’t yet told her is that I am Bankrupt and probably not allowed to start a business, or open a Business Bank account, I certainly am not allowed to apply for credit above £500 for the next 6 years. I’ll spring that on her at the end of the course, which ends this Friday.

        trev

        November 20, 2019 at 7:43 am

      • @ trev

        Just say no.

        Nancy Reagan (Deceased)

        November 20, 2019 at 1:28 pm

    • at the end of the day all you are is a profit unit where providers are concerned as they are 3rd party private company’s or quangos for profit they have no interest at all than getting there paperwork signed so they can gain funding for it for the most amount of profit possible thus why you get courses like making bath bombs and confidence boosting nonsense.

      and when you do sign you are classed as in training and not unemployed and then it becomes mandatory as you have a contract with the 3rd party provider and can be sanctioned buy them and still have to attend.

      superted

      November 19, 2019 at 10:12 pm

    • The providers are transferring their ‘customers’ onto universal credit. It makes it easier to push them off benefits into zero hour contract jobs like takeaway delivery. Beware too, a common trick that is used. They will get you to sign up for what you think it full-time work, it is only when you start that you realise that you are on a zero hour contract. Yet another reason for not signing up to providers.

      BEWARE: PROVIDER AT LARGE

      November 20, 2019 at 10:31 am

      • And once these providers get you onto Universal Credit, there is much more chance of getting a zero-hours job. When you do, they get an ‘outcome payment’. Just like on the old Work Programme.

        Barry

        November 20, 2019 at 1:29 pm

      • BEWARE. Once you are on UC, you can be compelled to apply for zero hour contract jobs, as they fall under the scope of part-time work. Unlike JSA where you cannot be compelled to apply for zero hour jobs.

        And since when can a provider transfer you onto UC from JSA, anyway? That’s down to the DWP, not he provider!

        jj joop

        November 20, 2019 at 3:05 pm

      • It was the provider, or rather the Interserve course tutor, who informed me and the rest of the group that we will all be transferred to UC in January, and she was very adamant about it saying that she works closely with the Jobcentre, has inside information and that it is definitely happening. But according to info supplied by superted it’s bollocks and she’s talking out of her arse. So the question(s) remains, where has she got her information from, why is she giving false information, is she misinformed and by whom, or is she lying to frighten us into suddenly being employable?

        trev

        November 20, 2019 at 3:36 pm

      • every job i apply for is zero hours so it makes no difference to me but the dwp can not ring up the employer and see how the interview went as it is a breach of the gdpr, not that they would tell them anything anyway.

        there is very little the dwp can do to check up on jobs applied for as the fines can be massive for the employers or agency why the work programme failed as could not find out what the employers names were and the agency’s told the providers nothing pmsl.

        all they can do in the jcp is give you a job to apply for and all you need to do is prove it has been done via email receipt ect.

        superted

        November 20, 2019 at 3:36 pm

      • or is she lying to frighten us into suddenly being employable?

        just dont listen to a word they say the only way to get on to uc is if you have a change of circumstance or the provider try to con you in to making a claim online.

        you really need to stop signing the providers contracts then you wont have to listen to this bull shit!!

        superted

        November 20, 2019 at 3:51 pm

      • @jj joop – No doubt we will be seeing a lot more of these tactics in the future. As the providers try to help things along by intimidating people into going on Universal Credit. It’s not their business, any UC transfers are down to the individuals or the DWP . I had one of these clowns ask me if I was on Facebook at the end of a course ! They wanted to keep in touch, in case I got a job. Not wanting to miss a job outcome payment more like.

        Paul

        November 20, 2019 at 4:11 pm

      • As if you would want to add one of those fuckers to your Facebook page!

        trev

        November 20, 2019 at 4:17 pm

      • army of angles had my facebook account banned as i turned up for 6 weeks mandatory work activity on time and told then i would sign nothing was given 10 quid to leave and not talk to anyone and would get no sanction.

        went straight down the jcp to tell them what they did and was not interested and would see me when i signed on.

        2 weeks later i had a sanction for non attendance so went on there fb page to ask wtf they was doing as did attend and was asked to leave.

        a staff member replied saying i was a smelly trap and a reject from society that was not wanted in there store.

        i said thanks for that as it proves i did attend your crappy shop with 8 slaves in there for the sole profit for the provider, there was a line off ppl waiting to use the dust pan and brush total joke lol.

        the sanction was dropped 😉 and my fb account banned for no reason at all.

        superted

        November 20, 2019 at 4:41 pm

      • “Army of Angles” that’s the first I’ve ever heard of them, had to Google it as at first thought you were referring to the Starvation Army as they were getting people sanctioned a few years back. No one, not any of these twats, should interfere with someone’s social media accounts or even have any access or interaction with them.

        trev

        November 20, 2019 at 5:43 pm

      • the provider had the contract for all the so called Charity shops at the time and also some other courses they had going on as well.

        problem was they was milking it to the point there was more staff than customers so just end up sitting about doing nothing most of the day anyway.

        superted

        November 20, 2019 at 5:58 pm

      • Army of Angles: who the hell dreams up these stupid-ass names, anyway. In Cambridgeshire and Norfolk, we now have company called Steadfast Training who are based in Spalding in Lincolnshire who offer courses for the unemployed. The Papworth Trust still have the contract for the WHP in Cambridge.

        http://www.steadfasttraining.co.uk/

        jj joop

        November 20, 2019 at 7:10 pm

      • We had one called ‘Pinnacle People’, oft referred to as “Pillocking People”.

        http://www.pinnaclepeople.co.uk/about-us/

        trev

        November 20, 2019 at 7:46 pm

      • its funny how all these providers offer the same old crap i done 15 years ago and nothing has really changed bar there fees going through the roof.

        i must have spent 10 years at these places and it has never helped me in to employment it has done the reverse over that many years and there course completed certs mean nothing to no one.

        this is worth a watch if you got a hour to spare 😉

        superted

        November 20, 2019 at 7:24 pm

      • It was General Pythagoras who led the ‘Army of Angles’ at the Battle of Tangent.

        Iso C Lees

        November 20, 2019 at 8:01 pm

      • Seetec = Shitec and Papworth Trust = Pimpworth Trust!

        jj joop

        November 21, 2019 at 6:58 am

      • Indeed, Iso C Lees, and look how that turned out 😉

        Hypo T Neuse

        November 21, 2019 at 12:02 pm

      • Be careful Superted nearly all these placements are local,mine was very bad also domineered by imature behaviour by paid staff.this could cause grudges’ against you and people talk.

        I’ve been informed that the Health and Work Programe will be mandatory from next March and was suggested to do it voluntary now to be fair the work coach at the Jobcentre did say that if I did attend it would be for two years’.Next March it is mandatory to participate.

        If it is anything like the last Work Programme health would have been better served not being on it!

        New Deal Provider

        November 21, 2019 at 3:00 pm

      • the whp needs a esf1420 form to be signed so the provider can gain funding for it from the esf you can refuse to sign it so it is not mandatory at all same as everything else they need your permission to share data, you can refuse.

        i never done the first wp or anything else for the last ten years as i wont sign anything as buy law i dont have to but one coach tried it on as got sanctioned for not signing a 3rd party contract and the dwp lost at tribunal and the coach was sacked for gross misconduct.

        so i wont be sent anywhere any time soon esp now i have the tribunal letter signed buy a judge the jcp bs will not work on me pmsl 😉

        to date i have had 29 sanction doubts and have one them all 😉

        superted

        November 21, 2019 at 3:16 pm

      • New Deal Provider

        I have just done a quick Google search but can find no reference to the WHP being mandatory for all as of March 2020. Keep us updated if you hear anything else, please.

        jj joop

        November 21, 2019 at 7:35 pm

      • I’m pretty sure it’s not happening because there was only a relatively small amount of funding allocated to the Work & Health Programme, a fraction of the funding that the original Work Programme received, so they have to be selective about who they refer and couldn’t possibly extend it to all Claimants.

        trev

        November 21, 2019 at 7:49 pm

      • it will be mandatory but not as you know it. as with all these things you will get a induction letter that will say you have to attend said provider on this day and at this time and it will also say that it is mandatory and if you dont comply we MAY sanction you.

        now it is mandatory you attend as per the letter but it is not mandatory you enter in to contracts with 3rd partys for profit or sign any of there paperwork as buy law and the dwp own rules state this.

        so it is voluntary as you can not be forced under threat of sanctions to sign anything as it makes the contract null and void and would be in breach of esf funding rules as well.

        so ask your work coach what happens if you are sent to the whp provider and wont sign the esf1420 form so they cant gain the funding for it but are willing to participate and see what he says.;)

        then show him this.
        https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/310933/response/760040/attach/html/3/FOI%20152%20Rev.pdf.html

        superted

        November 21, 2019 at 7:53 pm

  14. Scientists at the University of Cambridge using dedicated supercomputers running advanced algorithms on neural networks can now reveal that Boris was the clear winner in last night’s debate. Corbyn was a resounding dud who needs to get his glasses fixed.

    Brought to you by ✔FackcheckUK

    ✔FactCheckUK

    November 20, 2019 at 1:06 pm

    • Oh right, let’s all vote Conservative then…not.

      trev

      November 20, 2019 at 1:25 pm

  15. Fair go, Corbyn was better than a lot of people expected. It was 50 / 50.

    Frank Harper

    November 20, 2019 at 1:32 pm

    • Yep. I thought Corbyn came out slightly ahead of Johnson truth be told.

      Jim

      November 20, 2019 at 1:46 pm

  16. Deserted Working Links office in my hometown. All that’s left is an orange Working Links sign on the door, that they left behind in February when they went bust. They couldn’t even be bothered to take it down.
    Says it all really.

    Dave M.

    November 20, 2019 at 1:39 pm

  17. A word of advice; don’t believe the polls, in fact don’t even bother to read the polls, and above all don’t quote the polls:

    http://politicsandinsights.org/2019/11/20/opinion-polls-are-being-used-to-influence-public-opinion-rather-than-simply-measuring-it/

    trev

    November 20, 2019 at 1:42 pm

  18. End of the day these so-called ‘Training Providers’ are run for profit. They are like debt-collectors really.

    Rob

    November 20, 2019 at 1:43 pm

  19. The best moment in the debate for me was when the chairwoman, Julie Etchingham, asked Boris Johnson whether telling the truth during the election was important. When BoJo answered that he thought it was the audience, pretty much to a man/woman by the sound of it, broke into near hysterical laughter.

    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/election-debate-boris-johnson-laugh-heckled-itv-truth-lie-brexit-a9209836.html

    Not surprising really because BoJo was lying, there and then, while answering Etchingham’s question!

    You really couldn’t make it it.

    Jim

    November 20, 2019 at 1:45 pm

  20. I have a question. If Prince Andrew is giving up royal duties will he be giving back any of the money that he gets ?

    Roy Republican

    November 20, 2019 at 9:33 pm

    • No need, it will automatically be deducted from his Universal Credit and if he submits a Fit Note he might qualify for a food parcel from Fortnum & Mason’s 😏

      trev

      November 20, 2019 at 10:12 pm

  21. Your 100% correct ted. The endgame is fully micromanaging claimants via the computer system. One day you won’t even be able to fart without someone actually sanctioning you. We’re living in a psychopaths wet dream of full control. Even George Orwell couldn’t have envisioned it. But It’s gone far beyond 1984. We’re too domesticated as humans now. Eventually all humans are compliant and accepting of authority. Look what is happening in Hong Kong. We’re born into the system, and our parents are just as brainwashed as the last generation. Well said, ted.

    Lara Howells

    November 20, 2019 at 10:27 pm

  22. I don’t sign on . Because of Mental health I get my money paid every two weeks,ESA which is a good rate I think .and I get middle rate pip. Getting it all was easy, I got involve north west to help . I have no complaints.

    j allen

    November 20, 2019 at 10:37 pm

  23. Andrew Coates

    November 21, 2019 at 11:24 am

  24. roach wants access to a job account to see if i have been looking for an applying for jobs? is this allowed?
    i keep hearing about data protection on here. is roach allowed to look over me shoulder when i am logged in? do i even need to log on to a job account on the jc computer? thanks

    sarah

    November 21, 2019 at 11:58 am

  25. The party of law and order.

    November 21, 2019 at 2:49 pm


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