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Grenfell Tower Victims, Tower Block Evacuees, and Benefits.

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As More People Evacuated from Tower Blocks, what will happen to their Benefits? 

Reports on the way the Grenfell Tower victims have, and will be, affected by the benefits system are beginning to appear.

Last Thursday there was this, in the Guardian,

Grenfell residents feared benefit sanctions – they are too used to being ignored

If you’ve followed the aftermath of the Grenfell Tower fire on social media, one disturbing revelation has stood out: the fear that victims could have their benefits sanctioned because they were not able to get to the jobcentre to sign on.

Incredibly, representatives of local residents who approached local Jobcentre Plus officials and Department for Work and Pensions (DWP) staff in North Kensington report being told that it could “not be guaranteed” that people caught up in the fire and its aftermath would not be penalised if they were unable to sign on.

Last night, when the Guardian approached them for comment, the DWP confirmed that normal jobcentre rules – including financial sanctions routinely issued to claimants who miss appointments – had been suspended indefinitely for former Grenfell Tower tenants and other local residents who claim unemployment benefits.

A local resident who said he was acting on behalf of the community claimed that the DWP only later moved to clarify the position because of pressure on social media. “Once it became clear that there was media attention focused on them, they have finally done the right thing,” he said. “Why should it take shame for them to act? Where is their humanity?”

As anyone who has been put through the Tories’ benefit system knows, “humanity” and the DWP are two things that do not tend to go together. Rather, it’s a department that in recent years has become synonymous with cruelty.

Followed by this,

Former residents of Grenfell Tower will not be exempt from the bedroom tax and the benefit cap, the government has confirmed – although ministers have ordered that any tenants affected are prioritised for special payments to offset any losses.

Guidance from the Department for Work and Pensions (DWP) says councils should ensure Grenfell tenants hit by welfare reforms should be given so-called discretionary housing payments (DHPs) to protect them from potential housing benefit shortfalls of hundreds of pounds a month.

The government has promised that all Grenfell residents will be rehoused permanently as close as possible to their former home. This week it secured 68 social rented apartments in a new block in Kensington to provide permanent accommodation for those made homeless by the fire.

The guidance is the latest example of ministers moving to soften normal benefit rules for Grenfell residents. Earlier this week it said jobless tenants would not be sanctioned for failing to look for a job, and that a planned roll-out of universal credit in North Kensington next month would be put on hold.

A DWP spokeswoman said: “We have already relaxed benefit rules for anyone affected by the Grenfell Tower fire and our staff are handling people’s claims with sensitivity, understanding and flexibility.

“As part of this, our recent guidance to local authorities is that they should treat these residents as a priority for extra payments to help with their rent if they are rehoused in a larger property.”

But,

….experts said that providing DHP support was not always a permanent solution for tenants affected by welfare reform, especially if Grenfell tenants were allocated permanent homes that were too big and unaffordable under housing benefit rules.

Under the bedroom tax, residents in permanent social housing who are deemed to have more bedrooms than they require are docked housing benefit. In London, bedroom-taxed households typically have shortfalls of around £23 a week.

The benefit cap limits the total amount of benefits paid to out-of-work households to £442 a week in London. In Kensington and Chelsea,  latest figures show that in February 421 residents were capped. The majority suffered a benefit shortfall of £100 a week, though in some cases it was as much as £400 a week.

Discretionary housing payments, as the name implies, are normally given out at the discretion of the council and there is no guarantee that tenants – usually those at risk of homelessness as a result of rent arrears caused by welfare reform – will receive a DHP payment. The DWP guidance suggests councils should relax the usual rules for Grenfell tenants.

Each local authority sets its own criteria to assess DHP claims, with claimants normally having to produce extensive details of bank accounts, savings and loans to justify why they should qualify for financial help to stay in their home. Kensington and Chelsea’s standard five-page form asks claimants to justify why they “need to live at this address in this particular area” and “Are there any reasons preventing you from moving to other accommodation or another area?”.

Although the guidance states that there is no limit to the length of time a DHP award may be made, permanent awards are rare, and are often restricted to a few months.

This week a judge criticised DHPs in a ruling that declared it was unlawful for single parents with children under two to be subject to the benefit cap. Mr Justice Collins said that DHPs were a temporary solution that gave “no peace of mind” to capped tenants and provided an “unsatisfactory safeguard” against homelessness.

He added: “For those such as the claimants who are living on the edge of, if not within, poverty the [DHP] system is simply not working with any degree of fairness.”

Grenfell Tower victims could be hit by the Bedroom Tax in their new homes

The Mirror says: The DWP is scrambling to cover the cost of the hated levy for any victims who move into a bigger flat.

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Written by Andrew Coates

June 26, 2017 at 10:33 am

99 Responses

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  1. I used to live 5 minutes away from the Chalcots estate in Swiss Cottage London. The Council are spending £500,000 a day in Hotel bills to care for these residents. The Council now say the works will take 6 weeks not 4. With Camden Council you have to times thing by 4. 6 x 4 = 24 weeks. At £3.5M a week in Hotel bills. 24 x £3.5M = £84M in Hotel Bills. Since the works carried out were £66M that is £66M + £84M = £150M on a fuck up.

    Ok Roger Evans what we are going to do is threaten to set the tower block on fire [of course we won`t but they don`t know that] so every police man & council person evacuate the tower block or we will set it o fire. since it is a siege mentality we would like to put in a food order like down at sports hall.

    Stepping Razor Sound Plate System

    June 26, 2017 at 10:56 am

    • ditto – in one of the just evacuated towers – only one lift out of two working at any given time.

      shirleynott

      June 27, 2017 at 11:15 pm

  2. 60 towers failed testing as of Sunday Afternoon – that is as I and doug suspected 100% of building checked so far.

    Its looking increasingly likely that 70%+ of such building are like that [I would predict in the high 80% but I am just cynical like that…] out of 600 total.

    And I do myself consider what happened to be murder – at the alter of money, for profit.

    Gazza

    June 26, 2017 at 11:38 am

    • Thousands more people should be evacuated from tower blocks while cladding is tested, housing minister Alok Sharma says.

      Evening Standard, just now: http://www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/thousands-more-people-should-be-evacuated-from-tower-blocks-while-cladding-is-tested-housing-a3573206.html

      And,

      “A pensioner who is refusing to leave her home on the Chalcots estate today claimed her car was towed away to force her out and accused Camden council of deploying an “army” of security marshals.

      Rajwant Ludher, who owns a flat in Bray block, said she had been left “walking the streets with nowhere to go.”

      Ms Ludher, a police and court service interpreter in her seventies, added: “They towed away my car, I didn’t know why. They only told me yesterday I had to go. But where can I go? I have no family, I am from Malaysia, have been in Britain since I was a student.

      “The security here is like an army — it’s like a war zone here. They are a law unto themselves. It’s terrible the way we have been treated.”

      More than a hundred marshals in high-vis vests were on the estate today as a handful of residents remained. The occupants of 600 flats have been of-fered temporary accommodation in hotels and warned they may not be able to return for up to a month while cladding is removed and safety work done on gas pipes and fire doors. ”

      http://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/army-of-marshals-tried-to-force-me-out-of-camden-flat-pensioner-says-a3573196.html

      Andrew Coates

      June 26, 2017 at 11:57 am

      • OT: Grenfell Tower US Based Cladding Firm

        http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-40409981
        Grenfell Tower: Cladding firm ends global sales for tower blocks
        .
        .
        .
        due to “inconsistencies in building regulations around the world.”

        ME: Er, having worked in the Gov Dept responsible for Trade – it is a requirement to trade anywhere to anyone to obey the local rules – do not obey, cannot trade – this is in both direction trade in or out. It’s why there are things called Trade Agreements, you know so it is clear what is required [Except in the case of Trump/Farage/Mad Mayhem who insists you trade at a disadvantage]. Except, in the case of this set of scum, that does not appear to be the case…

        Gazza

        June 26, 2017 at 4:15 pm

    • FAO: John McDonnell MP:

      You don’t ‘murder’ at an altar you daft chuff- you sacrifice! ‘Sacrificed at the altar of money’ would be more apt.

      Dictionary Corner

      June 26, 2017 at 12:10 pm

      • That is absolutely right!

        Apart from anything else it makes clearer that people were not killed by individuals but by the way a system encouraged criminal negligence. .

        Andrew Coates

        June 26, 2017 at 3:30 pm

      • The Wicker Man

        June 26, 2017 at 7:57 pm

      • The Wicker Man

        June 26, 2017 at 7:58 pm

  3. Jobcentre roach loses rag with ‘Mohammad’. “HOW MANY CHILDREN DO YOU HAVE?” “Ten”. “YOU HAVE TEN CHILDREN?”

    Utterly disgraceful behaviour from racist jobcentre! We should be extending our help, friendship and support to ‘Mohammad’, his family and his friends.

    Scum jobcentre staff no doubt doubt when our friends from overseas and their families were burned alive in Grenfell Tower

    Tower Hamlets

    June 26, 2017 at 11:44 am

  4. Jobcentre roach loses rag with ‘Mohammad’. “HOW MANY CHILDREN DO YOU HAVE?” “Ten”. “YOU HAVE TEN CHILDREN?”

    Utterly disgraceful behaviour from racist jobcentre staff! We should be extending our help, friendship and support to ‘Mohammad’, his family and his friends.

    Scum jobcentre staff no doubt cheered when our friends from overseas and their families were burned alive in Grenfell Tower

    Tower Hamlets

    June 26, 2017 at 11:45 am

    • Comment: APPROVED!!

      The Politically Correct Brigade

      June 26, 2017 at 12:05 pm

    • How can the DWP be described as “cruel” when they allow this? There cannot be another country in the world where you would get away with this. The UK must have the softest welfare system on the planet! Try going to wherever ‘Mohammad’ came from and expect the Government there to house and feed you, your ‘wife’ and ten kids… and counting. Would Australia welcome ‘Mohamed’? Like hell they would! The States? No chance! Somewhere in Eastern Europe? Big ‘fuck off’!

      The only ‘cruelty’ the DWP dish out are to the indigenous population. Piss-takers like ‘Mohamed’ are never sanctioned. And if you notice they always pretend they “no speak English”. They never utter anything beyond a ‘yes’ or ‘no’. The indigenous population should limit their vocabulary likewise.

      Bethnal Green

      June 26, 2017 at 1:02 pm

    • Allah, commands that we go forth and multiply with many wives and bring forth many children. It is written in Holy Quran.

      Peace

      Ali

      June 26, 2017 at 2:44 pm

      • Sounds like an excuse for a right ole shagathon 😉

        Jesus H Christ

        June 26, 2017 at 2:47 pm

    • That’s the reason we are heading for Brexit and increased food prices. Peeps are not daft. They no what’s going on. We are also told that our friends from abroad contribute to our economy. So how does a lazy bastard sat on their arse all day and night shagging a sex slave of a wife and getting her continually pregnant and popping out kids contribute to the UK’s economy? It doesn’t! These useless fuckers are nowt but a drain on the public. Who wants to go out and work all day to pay for a useless piece of shit to spread their genes. This is why the jobcentre staff get angry, because they see this shit all day. but they can’t take their anger out on these bastards, so they take it out on the next hapless sop sat across the desk. The UK should have had a point system like in Australia and kept these useless fuckers out. You keep giving them money, they just laugh and just keep breeding. They are even advertising on satellite channels such as Somali Cable, come to the UK and free this and that, even driving lessons. The UK is a laughing stock. A cynic would think it was all part of a plan to bring down the Welfare State. The Welfare State equivalent of a website Denial of Service attack.

      Sword of Unpalatable Truth

      June 26, 2017 at 7:47 pm

  5. For the Attention of John McDonnell MP:

    Murder: the unlawful premeditated killing of a human being by another

    Dictionary Corner

    June 26, 2017 at 12:02 pm

    • Dictionary Corner

      if you make a decision, knowing full well that it will potentially lead to a persons death that is murder. [Say like a person is injured by yourself and you do not take steps to get medical attention]
      I know, I was the Jury Foreman at a murder Trial at the old bailey.

      Gazza

      June 26, 2017 at 12:49 pm

      • Greenfell Tower, murder? What about ‘fallen victim to political decisions’? What was the verdict? GUILTY AS HELL? Or did the trial even get that far?

        An insight into the workings of the jury room during a murder case would make for an interesting post.

        12 Angry Men

        June 26, 2017 at 1:47 pm

    • “If you make a decision, knowing full well that it will potentially lead to a persons death that is murder.” Well, that makes the DWP murderers all the way from Iain Duncan Smith down to the ‘decision makers’ to the cockroaches because they have all made decisions knowing full well that it will potentially lead to a persons death, and in many cases, tragically, have.

      12 Angry Men

      June 26, 2017 at 1:51 pm

  6. Evacuated Chalcots tenants on airbeds for third night but 200 remain in tower blocks

    Tenant Mandy Ryan was so disgusted with ‘filthy’ temporary accommodation she went back to her flat

    CNJ – 25th June 2017

    EVACUATED council tenants are sleeping on blow-up airbeds in the hall of the Swiss Cottage Leisure Centre for a third night with the council still struggling to find hotels for everybody.

    Around 200 people are understood to still be inside the tower blocks of the Chalcots Estate, despite being told on Friday evening that all residents must leave on urgent fire safety grounds.

    Of this number, around 20 are saying they do not want to leave under any circumstances, with the rest refusing to go until more comfortable arrangements than airbeds or run down hotels are provided.

    Read More:
    http://camdennewjournal.com/article/evacuated-chalcots-tenants-on-airbeds-for-third-night-but-200-remain-in-tower-blocks

    Stepping Razor Sound Plate System

    June 26, 2017 at 12:44 pm

    • You would think she was being asked to sleep in a shop doorway, live in a tent! Or a prison cell! What is she expecting? The Ritz! This is just the standard you can expect from an average hotel room. ‘Faulty socket’, can be fixed in a jiffy. The toilet is as clean as a whistle. Nothing to stop here giving the bathroom floor a mop if she wants. And a bit of paint splashed around the edge when the new light has been installed. The conduit going into the light is just where the room has been re-wired. All re-wiring is done like that. A load of nonsense! A lot of people dossing down in shop door-ways would love to put their head down in there. As for airbeds, they are really quite comfortable.

      Homeless

      June 26, 2017 at 1:20 pm

      • Has this silly woman never seen Housing Enforcers? She hasn’t got a clue!

        Mat Alwright

        June 26, 2017 at 1:40 pm

      • Like the homeless have a computer. The Tories are shitting in there suicide.

        Stepping Razor Sound Plate System

        June 26, 2017 at 2:04 pm

    • This is like a palace compared to your average student bed-sit. Some bed-sits don’t even have hot water!

      Bedsitter

      June 26, 2017 at 1:42 pm

    • Yes the Leaseholders are not pleased, being a leaseholder & suing the Freehold the Council. Tory Chat Bots not defending the homeless. What next Ghost Ants in all Tower Blocks !!!

      Stepping Razor Sound Plate System

      June 26, 2017 at 2:00 pm

    • Tory Murderers – The Leasehold now want to sell but the council says you can`t.

      Tory Chat Bots now defending the homeless !!! What next free school meals in the UK not just in NI.

      Stepping Razor Sound Plate System

      June 26, 2017 at 2:02 pm

  7. Marie

    June 26, 2017 at 1:28 pm

    • Fire safety experts warned as long ago as 1999 that the cladding used on buildings such as Grenfell Tower posed a deadly threat to hundreds of residents inside, it has emerged.

      Building safety experts for David Cameron’s Conservative government warned last year that the drive for greater energy efficiency meant more and more buildings were being wrapped in potentially combustible materials.

      http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/06/17/warnings-deathtrap-high-rise-building-cladding-ignored-decades/

      ken

      June 26, 2017 at 6:23 pm

    • That’s wrong. Murder means deliberately to set out to kill someone and to do so premeditatively; that 100% isn’t the case here.. While I’m sure that the Conservatives couldn’t care less whether the poor burn alive, I am absolutely certain that the Tories wouldn’t have wanted the kind of publicity they are getting because of Grenfall. As much as I hate the Tories McDonnell is doing Labour no favours by talking shit like this at a time like this.

      The Sword of Truth

      June 26, 2017 at 6:49 pm

      • Murder wouldn’t stick expect on a Gazza or O’Donnell jury.

        What about manslaughter – Law, the unlawful killing of a human being without malice aforethought.

        Black's Law

        June 26, 2017 at 7:55 pm

      • My bet is that at the end of the day “poor regulation” will be blamed, rather than individuals, and there will be much talk about “learning lessons” and “never letting this happen again”. Corporate manslaughter is a very difficult charge to make stick. I mean hardly anybody has been found guilty of it in the courts. Who could carry the can? The builders for using substandard materials? Councillors, most of whom are laymen and don’t understand much about civil engineering? Advisers to the council who didn’t do their jobs properly? Planners and accountants trying to save money by using the cheapest materials and labour available? The people who drew up the regulations? Conservative governments who watered down heath and safety or failed to draft proper ones? To me it looks as if a lot of different failures caused the disaster and no particular individuals attract enough blame personally for a charge of manslaughter to stick.

        Too much went wrong collectively to see who was the most guilty.

        Echium Spike

        June 27, 2017 at 6:03 am

      • McDonnell is making himself look like a mouthy twat again. Labour councils up and down the country used the same cladding as Tory ones. The fire could have happened anywhere. McDonnell is not honest, measured or statesmanlike. This man is not a fit person to hold high office.

        Salt of the Earth

        June 27, 2017 at 6:07 am

      • Neither is Corbyn honest, measured or statesman like. He was caught off guard at Glastonbury saying that he wants to open the floodgates to even more i*mmigration, scrap Trident (against official Labour Party policy), and all the usual crap designed to appeal to the idiot vote. And what were Corbyn and McDonnell doing at Glastonbury anyway, appealing to the ‘yoof’ vote, they ‘yoof’ vote whom can afford £238 + £5 booking fee for a ticket?

        Pyramid Stage

        June 27, 2017 at 6:26 am

      • Murder would only be applicable as a charge if a person or person(s) had deliberately set the building alight with the intent of killing the occupants inside. McDonnell is talking out of a hole in his arse.

        Pyramid Stage

        June 27, 2017 at 6:34 am

  8. Grenfell Tower: Cladding firm ends global sales for tower blocks

    BBC – 26th July 2017

    The US firm that supplied cladding used on London’s Grenfell Tower says it has ended global sales of the product for use in high-rise blocks.

    Arconic said it was “discontinuing” sales of Reynobond PE for tower blocks due to “issues” identified by the fire, which is feared to have killed 79.

    Read More:
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-40409981

    Stepping Razor Sound Plate System

    June 26, 2017 at 4:50 pm

  9. Witch May has NO money tree for nurses but finds one for the DUP to cling on to power.

    http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/remember-theresa-told-struggling-nurse-10690896

    Marie

    June 26, 2017 at 5:26 pm

    • Marie

      Don’t forget the ConMen MP’s now kicked out of the Money Trough known as Paerliment who are “Promised” Financial help to their unfortunate demise

      Gazza

      June 26, 2017 at 5:27 pm

  10. They could do with a kick up the jacksy too bloody murdering scum.

    Marie

    June 26, 2017 at 7:32 pm

  11. What Jeremy Corbyn Must Do To Become The Next Prime Minister.

    Jeremy Corbyn must lead a Labour Party that is pro-business, patriotic and tough on welfare to become Prime Minister, a new post-election poll shows.

    A GQR poll conducted for the TUC, and shared exclusively with HuffPost UK, shows Labour made huge gains with young and non-voters at the general election but has a mountain to climb with the over-65s and Tory backers on Brexit and the economy.

    http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/poll-jeremy-corbyn-may_uk_595110cfe4b05c37bb77ce97

    What Tories Must Do, be dropped down the sewer, that will do.

    enigma

    June 27, 2017 at 10:37 am

  12. US healthcare bill leaves 22m more without cover.

    UK healthcare soon to leave millions without cover.

    enigma

    June 27, 2017 at 10:39 am

  13. Gig economy, be afraid, be very afraid.

    The way this scheme has been packaged has been one of freedom of choice, do what you want, when you want. The problem with that is it shifts a governments responsibility to ensure business functions in a way it not only allows a person to afford to live but also allows a government to provide public services.

    All businesses are the revolving doors of how we exist (money), under our current model. Both we and governments in turn benefit from this. If we for the moment remove public welfare if you don’t work, you cant take the money you help generate and consume, mostly for survival, cant pay taxes,NI and thus provide public services. So effectively consuming also acts as a reinvestment for us to remain in work.

    Its a very fine line that is not only fragile to collapses of businesses but also abuse in terms of placing profit before people.

    The gig game will if we allow it to continue as it is, shift all the onus on to you to the complete and utter privatization of everything. Like many a scfi movie, corporations,big business will rule and im afraid to say this but this is exactly what our governments want and as much as i would like to say there sleep walking into it, that’s simply not true.

    Projected means in time every single job bar those right at the very top will be at the exact same rate. Infact it will be so equal, there do away with money (replace with credits so you cant just eat everywhere for example and over consume) and simply state you work when and how they tell you and we will give you food and shelter. Unless people invent and are successful in creating a balance of companies big enough to challenge the existing stock, life for our next generations and possibly us, could be very unpleasant if you like your freedom away from the grid.

    This is the globalization your heading for. Yes you say the world is opposed and preventing it or will yet you haven’t stopped its progression in the least as the agenda continues to push right through the cracks and back doors your not watching.

    doug

    June 27, 2017 at 10:58 am

    • Here’s some more misery for us all to look forward to.

      Great recession fears as bankers warn next global crash could arrive ‘with a vengeance

      http://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/news/global-financial-crash-central-bankers-warn-back-with-a-vengeance-china-debt-gdp-ratio-a7807811.html.

      enigma

      June 27, 2017 at 11:42 am

      • Enigma

        If you didn’t know China has been mounting a massive investment program on an epic scale while trying to rope the rest of the world into it on out of air money.
        China wont admit it but there in dire straights financially and are hanging on a gamble which considering there past ones, highly liable not to end well.
        There past insistence to invest in everything around the world would imply this has all been a long term scheme to hedge there bets for backing based on yet more out of air money.

        The easiest way to see what your article implies is not to imagine the pound going to zero but multiples of negativity.

        doug

        June 27, 2017 at 12:04 pm

      • Yeah, well, y’all know what to do then. You still got plenty of time to stock up on beans, guns, bullets and barbed wire.

        **POLICE STATE 101 – TOTAL GLOBAL ENSLAVEMENT! OWN IT NOW ON HIGH-QUALITY DVD!**

        Alex Jones

        June 27, 2017 at 12:38 pm

      • And don’t forget to the GOLD! You are going to need it to trade for essential supplies when the Shit Hits the Fan ™

        **POLICE STATE 101 – TOTAL GLOBAL ENSLAVEMENT! OWN IT NOW ON HIGH-QUALITY DVD!**

        Ted Midas

        June 27, 2017 at 12:45 pm

    • Flexible work and in-work conditionality

      Now we all pretty much heard IDS first but after many others tout to benefits of ZHCs,self employment/gig work yet somehow he contradicts this with the inclusion of inwork benefits conditionality for UC claimants because there either not earning enough or working long enough.

      For a person on NLW, to escape total dependency on the state, they would have to dependent on family size,location,etc work an extra 20 to 30 plus hours a week above the standard average of work per week.

      Not only does the gig trick prevent people escaping state dependency but also means less revenue for the government as more and more people only get to work around 20 hours a week at worst, 30 hours at best because of contributing factors.

      doug

      June 27, 2017 at 11:56 am

    • Nearly half of Britons think the government should raise taxes and increase spending, an annual poll of public opinion suggests.

      http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-40408576

      You have got to laugh at this. The last politician to promise higher taxes was Labour’s John Smith. The rest is history. Britons always seems to support higher taxes and higher spending but any politician or political party who promises to reduce their chances of electoral success to zero.

      Increased spending doesn’t mean increased spending on public services it means increased spending on public sector pay. Do Britons really want to pay more in tax to hand it over to already over-paid coppers? Like hell they do! So why is Jezza always banging on about the cap on public sector pay? What about the benefits freeze, Jezza?

      Increasing (public sector) pay is bad for people struggling on fixed (and frozen) incomes such as benefits. It creates inflation; makes life more of a struggle for those already struggling. But as if comedy act Jezza and O’Donnell give a shit. We should be moving to remove income disparity not increase it, reducing income inequality. At least we can rely on the DUP to vote down his stupid amendment to the Queens’ Speech to remove the cap on public sector pay.

      First Responder

      June 28, 2017 at 6:43 am

      • First responder

        No, a portion of 2’942 people polled said this.There’s a big difference between this figure and an entire population.

        “A total of 2,942 people in England, Scotland and Wales were questioned between July and November last year by social research organisation NatCen”. Bottom line of the BBC article you linked to.

        Considering past polls and there outcomes, i don’t really see anyone taking this seriously when you consider 2’942 people only represents 0.00452% of the total population.

        doug

        June 28, 2017 at 9:46 am

      • Six out of ten people think it is wrong for benefit claimants to use legal loopholes to increase their payments, compared with 48% thinking it is wrong to use legal loopholes to pay less tax.

        https://uk.news.yahoo.com/british-social-attitudes-report-becoming-sympathetic-benefit-claimants-080622368.html

        So 12% not only begrudge benefit claimants but also begrudge paying a fair amount of taxes.

        doug

        June 28, 2017 at 10:40 am

      • Totally disingeneous, even by BBC standards! The article should more accurately read: “Nearly half of 2,942 Britons think the government should raise taxes and increase spending, an annual poll of public opinion suggests. If you didn’t get to the disclaimer written in small print at the very end of the article compared with the article heading in bold print you could easily come away with the (false) impression that the BBC had asked all 65 million Britons. Deliberate or what?

        Laura Kuntsberg

        June 28, 2017 at 11:42 am

  14. Bank of England takes action over bad loans

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-40416976

    enigma

    June 27, 2017 at 11:48 am

    • Enigma

      Don’t forget borrowing has gone throw the roof.

      I said did i not ages ago that this country was propped up on personal borrowing and bubbles, that it would be allowed to grow to deflect the true situation. Did i not state the depression has been protracted in a covert way despite not knowing the true outcome.

      I expect these revelations will spur the public to consolidate and where required likely,sell,dump. I cant state this as the case yet as its hard to know with an ever changing economy nationally and globally and how government on bonds and banking will react just yet.

      doug

      June 27, 2017 at 12:13 pm

      • Thanks to my very few wants I’m free of any debt. I like it that way. …

        enigma

        June 27, 2017 at 12:26 pm

      • A lucky git, to some!.

        enigma

        June 27, 2017 at 12:28 pm

      • It’s a funny kind of borrowing too. A lot of it is not to purchase something material, like a three piece suite, or a TV, or whatever, but simply to meet ordinary everyday living expenses like food and utilities.

        Dilda

        June 27, 2017 at 1:29 pm

  15. While British peasants live impoverished through austerity the Royal parasites just keep getting richer (The lying media still HIDE most of her ill gotten gains)

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-40412343

    Marie

    June 27, 2017 at 1:36 pm

  16. There seems to be a trend with some goods and service to

    Your pay monthly plan will be adjusted every year by the rate of inflation

    Its becoming a problem and cannot be ignored as the UK exits the EU.What the true cost of this exit means remains to be seen.People on low incomes and state benefits which are not increasing,inflation is a real problem and others also.

    Some might say it encourages people into work however that ignores the fact of the chances of finding work especially for older people and other groups also those with poor skills.Attempting to bully and intimidate people out of Jobcentres nitpicking and creating an atmosphere,for whats simply not there.

    It shows how that department is taking the issue of those groups seriously too and how their attempting to tackle the problem.

    ken

    June 27, 2017 at 2:03 pm

  17. UK National Cyber Security Centre says it is ‘aware of global ransomware incident’

    Companies in UK, US, Germany, Ukraine, Russia and Norway among those affected so far

    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/global-ransomware-cyber-security-centre-ukraine-russia-wannacry-wpp-nhs-attack-hacking-virus-a7810716.html

    enigma

    June 27, 2017 at 5:10 pm

  18. Foxglove

    June 27, 2017 at 7:06 pm

  19. Calls to halt the ‘welfare tsunami’ of universal credit

    Universal Credit (UC), which has caused social havoc in people’s lives in other parts of the UK, is on its way to Northern Ireland.

    The government’s flagship benefit reform, universal credit (UC): is five years behind schedule, with delays announced seven times and a price tag rising to a staggering £16bn.

    http://viewdigital.org/2017/06/26/calls-halt-welfare-tsunami-universal-credit/

    ken

    June 27, 2017 at 10:05 pm

  20. What is Good Morning Britain playing at? They have had Grenfell survivors on all morning. All foreigners of some sort. One is a black woman, a single parent, sat with four young children, waving her arms in the air like someone demented: “I got 400 volts outside my flat. I not paying my rent.” Two points. 1). The 400 volts is a distribution point for the 415V three-phase electricity supply, one phase of 240V enters each flat.
    2). She doesn’t pay any rent out of her own pocket since she is on benefits. What a joke of a programme!

    Piers and Susanna

    June 28, 2017 at 7:28 am

    • With the ashes of dozens of incinerated people hardly hold this is NOT the time to be attacking anybody involved in the Grenfall tragedy. Does it matter less if a person burned alive was foreign rather than British? Or dependent on benefits as most people living in rented accommodation our nation’s capital are out of necessity not by choice? Have a word with yourself for heaven’s sake and try to to better in the future. Your bilious comments let you down.

      Dusty

      June 28, 2017 at 9:35 am

  21. On ITV by the way. Who would have thunk!

    Piers and Susanna

    June 28, 2017 at 7:29 am

    • ITV – is there ever anything worth watching on that channel?

      Gogglebox

      June 28, 2017 at 11:06 am

      • Answer: NO!

        Square Eyes

        June 28, 2017 at 1:23 pm

  22. Enough of this shit. Switching over to Dan and Louise on BBC Breakfast.

    Piers and Susanna

    June 28, 2017 at 7:32 am

    • I respectively suggest you switch to another website too, my friend.

      Dusty

      June 28, 2017 at 9:37 am

      • Dusty

        Better not suggest the BBC then.

        doug

        June 28, 2017 at 9:50 am

      • doug

        “Conservative Home” and “The Conservative Women”, particularly the latter, would be my recommendation.

        Dusty

        June 28, 2017 at 1:28 pm

      • The Conservative Woman

        Best of Social Conservatism

        “Feminism Will Destroy Women As Well As Men

        I get a lot of flack on this blog about my writing about women and female sexuality. I get a lot of angry letters from men who think female sexuality is shameful and evil or should be repressed. I get a lot of angry letters from women who think that my writing about intimacy and vulnerability is counterproductive to showing women as strong and independent.

        It’s mind-boggling how angry people are about a woman writing about mature, sexual, powerful, healthy women who love men. It’s the new thing to hate, apparently.

        I’m interested in our human nature, what drives us biologically, emotionally and sexually. The point I try to make in my writing is that the way the laws and society are right now is in conflict with our true nature. Women want to be desired and pursued. We also want to be protected.

        None of that is happening with feminism.

        Modern feminism is trying to reverse the roles with women making all the rules, setting the tone and controlling the environment both sexual and political.

        Women deny the protection of loving, caring men while trying to be “strong and independent” and as a result they’ve turned to the government and legal system for protection. They’ve demonized masculinity by redefining dominance, strength, power and leadership as predatory qualities.

        There is a push for women to not take responsibility for their behavior in the moment (victim culture) but use these resources to settle the score later. Or use govt. and the law as bullies to fulfill their agendas, provide protection, provide resources and cater to their wants.

        But we are seeing now that these protections are paper-thin because while women now have almost everything they ever wanted, we are anxious, depressed, struggle with mental illness and more dissatisfied and unhappy than we have ever been!

        Our nature is at odds with society because the tables have turned and men, in their desire to please women, have allowed them to control the agenda. It has backfired.

        I’m sure I’ll get called out on this but there is a lot of truth to the fact that women don’t really know what we want. We say we want one thing and we think we want one thing because we have an idea of what it’s like and it’s exciting, but when we get it we are miserable. We think we want to be in charge because it looks great and excites us when we see someone else being in charge and in control of everything, but when most of us are actually put in that position, we get anxious and handle it badly. We see this happen all the time. And by this I’m not saying women are inferior or that no women can lead. I think a lot of women are wonderful. And in a truly nurturing, supportive, empowering environment we can achieve and accomplish amazing things. But we aren’t in that environment. We are in an environment that caters to whims, coddles us emotionally and doesn’t hold us accountable.

        If we celebrate the true strengths and talents of women instead of pushing women to compete to do what the boys do we would be a lot happier and more fulfilled. We would be less anxious. We’d be complementing the nature of men while expressing our feminine nature.

        This is the reason why I see feminists as the true misogynists. They are the ones who discredit and reject feminine qualities, female strengths. They are the ones who applaud when a woman succeeds on a man’s terms but shames and degrades women who succeed on her own terms. They want women to embrace casual sex, aggressive competition, and reject beauty, grace and traditional relationships. They will demean and insult women who want to embrace their feminine nature, who take comfort in the love of a man, who desire to please and commit to a man and who embrace feminine charm as a source of strength over aggression and intimidation.

        Now, the traditional idea of woman itself is under attack–favoring masculine qualities at one end of the spectrum and childlike qualities at the other while rejecting the strengths of mature feminine women. The woman: being a woman, loving like a woman, hurting like a woman, giving and caring like a woman, having an active sexual appetite for a man, desiring protection and security… these are the qualities under feminism will destroy just as soon as they’ve completed their destruction of the masculine male. And of course, we can see, it’s already starting.”

        View story at Medium.com

        The Conservative Woman

        June 28, 2017 at 2:40 pm

    • You could always tune-in to Iain Duncan Smith over on BBC Radio 2, might be more to your taste… 😉

      Square Eyes

      June 28, 2017 at 2:08 pm

      • … and political and racist viewpoint!

        Square Eyes

        June 28, 2017 at 2:11 pm

  23. STOP PRESS////STOP PRESS////STOP PRESS (GRENFELL TOWER)

    TAKE THIS WITH CAUTION TILL DEFINITELY CONFIRMED.

    Ive heard on the grapevine that the original planned cladding was rejected at the planning stage of the refurbishment (cant state at what period). Now its not out of the norm to change many things at this stage but this would as i said in previous posts suggest the blame could land on whom makes the rejection.

    Now considering its a drop in proposed cost rather than an increase, this does put although not confirm, cost cutting in the picture.

    doug

    June 28, 2017 at 10:01 am

    • BREAKING NEWS///BREAKING NEWS///BREAKING NEWS/// (GRENFELL TOWER)

      Theresa May: “The cladding used in Grenfell Tower was NOT compliant with building regulations.” (In response to a question by a J.Corbyn at Prime Minster’s Questions.)

      Breaking News

      June 28, 2017 at 11:12 am

    • … “A criminal investigation is now under way.”

      BREAKING NEWS///BREAKING NEWS///BREAKING NEWS/// (GRENFELL TOWER)

      Breaking News

      June 28, 2017 at 11:14 am

    • BREAKING NEWS///BREAKING NEWS///BREAKING NEWS/// (GRENFELL TOWER)

      TM: “We have building regulations. Why is it that in local authority after local authority we have seen material put up which is not compliant with those regulations.”

      BREAKING NEWS///BREAKING NEWS///BREAKING NEWS/// (GRENFELL TOWER)

      Breaking News

      June 28, 2017 at 11:17 am

    • An absolutely shocking performance from J. Corbyn as he scored own goal after own goal as he tried in vain to blame the Grenfell tragedy on “TORY CUTS!!!!” He looked positively shamed-faced as it was pointed out to him that the cladding of buildings began under a LABOUR government and it was a LABOUR government who brought in legislation transferring the inspection of buildings from the Fire Service to a “responsible person”. At least May had the decency to acknowledge that the problems which led to the tragedy at Grenfell Tower have been accruing over many decades and over many governments and local authorities of many colours. Using the deaths of so many who died in such a horrific manner to attempt to score party political points just made Corbyn look fundamentally dishonest and wholly pathetic. Corbyn and his side-kick O’Donnell should take up stand-up comedy.

      Annie C

      June 28, 2017 at 11:59 am

      • The cladding of buildings began under Blair’s government.

        Annie C

        June 28, 2017 at 12:00 pm

    • Why do high-rises keep failing fire tests?
      http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-40418266

      “Over the past week, the government has been testing high-rise tower blocks in England owned by councils and housing associations. All 95 of those tested so far have been discovered to be covered with an aluminium “rain-screen” exterior cladding that does not meet the required combustibility standards. You would be right to ask: how on earth can this have happened?

      The short answer is: the organisations responsible for maintaining standards in the building industry have been advising contractors not to take the regulations too literally.”

      Me: As doug and i have been saying the problems exposed by the fire run deep and are more extensive than people realise.

      One thing that is going to create great difficulty for this Gov is the answer to this question: The Grenfell residents are demanding legal aid – but this Gov got rid of it for poor people [thanks Gididot – notice how quite he’s gone on this] in the wake of this disaster they are going to have to fess up, but that will open a whole new can of worms as other stuff emerges [like for underemployed persons to address abuses by say DWp]

      interesting times for this Gov

      gazza

      June 28, 2017 at 1:21 pm

      • Annie C

        Any comment about the ConMen being responsible for removing legal advice to poor people, like for fire safety at Grenfell Towers

        gazza

        June 28, 2017 at 4:24 pm

      • Anne C

        Everything starts somewhere but in 2009 after such a disaster occurred an investigation began. The results were given to the succeeding government, the then coalition and it was rejected.
        This type of cladding made its way to our shores around 2005/6 even though available earlier from the states.
        Now the important thing here is, it could have all been avoided and changed as early as 2010/11 but this didn’t come. Further more it was the 2010-2015 government,further continued by our now government to install a borrowing cap on local councils that did play a part in sums available as was clear in the case of grenfell towers in a PDF document i posted on this very site written by Laura Johnson- Director of housing of royal borough of kensington and chelsea.
        We also know now the existing cladding behind the cause of the fire spread wasn’t the originally proposed cladding and that someone who has yet to be named, rejected it.

        Now usually proposed plans tend to get more expensive, usually dew to a lack of foresight,regulation changes,etc. In this case however the cost at a point was lowered. The question now is does this fall on the council or contract holder at a certain stage (contract filters down) and regardless was this a result of either no more funds or a someone looking to make a bit more profit. Lastly why did the coalition government reject the 2009 report.

        Only when these are answered will we truly know where that blames falls.

        doug

        June 29, 2017 at 9:43 am

      • Doug

        FR (Fire resistant/retardant cladding) which it is accepted would have saved the Greenfell residents lives would have cost an extra £5,000! It is a bit rich to blame this horrendous fire on “TORY CUTS!!!!” a la Jezza.. £5,000 is pocket change as far as government/council spending goes but it is a lot of money to a private contractor/individual. Say, that “Doug & Rodneys’s Cladding incorporating Rogue Traders of Peckham Ltd.” had secured the contract. Just think what you could have down with the extra £5,000 in your pocket. You would be tempted? 😉 Well, wouldn’t you, doug? 😉 The finger is pointing more towards a rogue contractor who decided to pocket an extra £5,000 minus backhanders to council officials, etc.

        Rogue Trader

        June 29, 2017 at 10:02 am

      • On top of that they had already spent something like £100 million on refurbishing the buildings. £5,000! “TORY CUTS!!!!”!? You are having a laugh!

        Rogue Trader

        June 29, 2017 at 10:05 am

      • “We also know now the existing cladding behind the cause of the fire spread wasn’t the originally proposed cladding and that someone who has yet to be named, rejected it.”

        Would you really want your name and address publicised if you were that person? Blame falling at your feet… lynched… hanging from nearest lamppost springs to mind. If you haven’t already noticed, doug, there are a lot of very angry people (and pitchforks) out there!

        The Angry Greenfell Pitchforks

        June 29, 2017 at 10:11 am

      • The Angry Greenfell Pitchforks

        We don’t seem to have a problem offering up normal folk so this person should be afforded no such discretion as like all of us, they have the right to the presumption of innocence until a court decides on guilt, not a right to anonymity. No such anonymity is afforded regarding which housing ministers who consistently gave no regard to the report on the Lakanal House fire.

        This aside its not a concealment as far as i know, its just no one as yet has looked into who that is and published it. Even that aside rejecting this original design still does not establish guilt as it may not have been the material but the overall cost of the proposed design tender such is the length and breath of the people,companies,council involved.

        At this stage all that matters is identifying where the errors that could have been avoided occurred and the motives behind the decisions. Peoples names if required come later.

        doug

        June 29, 2017 at 2:17 pm

  24. BREAKING NEWS///BREAKING NEWS///BREAKING NEWS/// (HILLSBOROUGH)

    Former Ch Supt David Duckenfield faces being charged with the manslaughter of 95 people at the Hillsborough disaster.

    Mr Duckenfield was the South Yorkshire Police (SYP) match commander at the FA Cup semi-final when 96 Liverpool fans were fatally injured in a crush.

    He faces the charge of manslaughter by gross negligence of 95 fans. Former SYP Ch Insp Norman Bettison is charged over alleged lies in the aftermath.

    Four others will also be prosecuted. Victims’ relatives have been informed.

    BREAKING NEWS///BREAKING NEWS///BREAKING NEWS/// (HILLSBOROUGH)

    Justice for Hillsborough

    June 28, 2017 at 11:26 am

    • After thirty long years it would be justice served to see these lying bastards sent down for their crimes but strongly suspect that which always seem to happen with (hand-picked? knobled? got at?) inquest juries these scum will be acquitted and walk free.

      The Hillsborough Families

      June 28, 2017 at 1:10 pm

  25. Dopey BO-JO makes a tit of himself by claiming corbyn supporters are part of a brainwashed cult.

    https://www.thecanary.co/2017/06/27/boris-johnson-finally-loses-claims-corbyn-supporters-part-brainwashed-cult-video/

    Marie

    June 28, 2017 at 12:03 pm

    • lol no we’re not… Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh, Jeremy Corbyn…Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh, Jeremy Corbyn…Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh, Jeremy Corbyn…Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh, Jeremy Corbyn… 😀 😀

      The Jezza Cult

      June 28, 2017 at 1:04 pm

      • You sound as if you’re having a wank… which I have to say explains a lot.

        Dusty

        June 28, 2017 at 1:27 pm

  26. Violet

    June 28, 2017 at 4:39 pm

  27. A couple of days ago BBC News (TV) were reporting from blocks where people were being thuggishly evacuated from tower blocks. Several elderly residents in great distress were saying that the council staff who were taking their details, once these poor buggers had been ousted from their homes that they would not be rehoused because they had animals.

    The councils (Chelsea & Kensington & Camden, & others) were refusing to rehome people who had pets.

    Now I know that not many of you will give a toss about this, but pets are very important to many people, of all types, for many people, the elderly, the sick and disabled, their pets are their main companionship and often the only other living being they have contact with outside of routine officialdom.

    One elderly lady was in tears, totally distraught, the awful female council official had told her that she would have to have her dog either put into the council animal shelter (a particularly ghastly place where it would stand a good chance of being killed or dying from the sheer stress that is rife in these places for animals who have already been traumatised) or, having her beloved dog “humanely” killed by a vet.

    The RSPCA have had every chance to step in and offer help and sanctuary to these poor people and their pets, yet so far all I have been able to get out of them is that they have ONE inspector present at the Grenfall site and no one who has been evacuated has come forward for help in getting back to their homes to tend to their animals. yet the RSPCA will shortly be using the Grenfell disaster as a vehicle to scrounge money from people to pay their high up staff salaries of £100k+

    We have gone so seriously wrong, we have lost compassion, I don’t think we will ever get it back.

    For any of you who respond with “people are more important than animals” just remember that human beings are animals (mammals) too, except we have lost the essential knowledge of just how important love and nurturing are for the survival of our species.

    Lucy

    June 29, 2017 at 12:02 pm

    • The RSPCA are useless fuckers. They won’t even rescue a cat stuck up a tree! There was a young kitten stuck up a tree around here a couple of winters ago in sub-zero temperatures. None of these fuckers who are always screaming for our money would lift a finger: RSPCA, police, fire service. That little kitten would have frozen to death if a bloke who climbed pylons for the electricity board haven’t rescued it. Useless fuckers the lot of them!

      Nora

      June 29, 2017 at 12:25 pm


    • The Difference Between Them And Us

      Viola

      June 29, 2017 at 12:28 pm


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