Ipswich Unemployed Action.

Campaigning for Unemployed Rights.

Universal Credit “on track”, or Maybe Not.

with 103 comments

Image result for universal credit

May well, Eventually, Possibly, be Ready, Sometime, Somewhere, for Some Claimants. 

Under-fire Universal Credit reform could now be ‘on right track’, says report.

Universal Credit has been “turned around from the brink of disaster” and “may eventually work”, according to a new report.

Naturally we do not believe a word of this:

A study has revealed the government’s reforms to the welfare system have been turned around from the brink of disaster three years after auditors warned the programme needed to be ‘re-set’.

In 2013, the National Audit Office said the multi-billion Universal Credit programme had to be ‘re-set’ due to be poor management, governance and financial control.

Today, the Institute for Government said Universal Credit is now on the road to recovery, and the lessons learnt could be applied to other big government projects in the future.

The report – Universal Credit: From disaster to recovery? – found the programme now has a more ‘realistic’ timetable to achieve, with completion due five years later than originally planned.

It is far too soon to tell whether Universal Credit will finally do the business,’ warned Nicholas Timmins, senior fellow at the IfG and report author. ‘There are elements of the policy that are still not entirely clear and others that may well need changing. Huge challenges remain – not just taking on new claims but transferring the many millions on existing benefits and tax credits, including some of the most vulnerable on Employment and Support Allowance. Its generosity has repeatedly been cut.

‘But the lessons from how it has been turned around from the brink of disaster to something that may eventually work could prove valuable for other government projects. And crucially, it now has a timetable that may finally prove realistic.’

More in the same vein: Universal credit back on track after reset, finds IfG review. (Public Finance).

This is perhaps the best informed report:

Universal Credit: ‘One dole to rule ’em all’ on verge of recovery – report

Some 12 years later we might have a working IT system

The ace reporters of The Register state,

The disastrous £16bn one-dole-to-rule-them-all Universal Credit programme may be turning a corner, according to a report by think-tank the Institute for Government.

The woes of the programme have been long-documented, with the National Audit Office three years ago revealing that the entire multi-billion programme had needed to be restarted after its initial launch in 2011.

Consequently, millions have been written off in IT costs.

But a report by IFG Senior Fellow Nicholas Timmins argues that the reforms are in a much better state, and something that is “recognisable” as Universal Credit may well emerge at the other end.

Today, around 300,000 people are actually receiving Universal Credit, against the many millions who would have been under the original timetable.

Completion is not due until 2022, a dozen years after the white paper announcing it, and five years later than originally planned.

The programme has been described as “one of the most heavily IT-enabled business changes in its existence”.

So the extent to which the programme might be seen as a success even if it does arrive in the next six years is questionable.

The scheme was intended to replace six in and out-of-work benefits, including tax credits, with a single, simpler system intended to ensure that any amount of work pays more than being on the dole.

Its scope remains vast, notes the IFG. “If and when completed, it is due to affect some 8 million households, many more people, and around a third of working-age population.”

Nicholas Timmins, senior fellow at the IFG and report author, said: “It is far too soon to tell whether Universal Credit will finally do the business. There are elements of the policy that are still not entirely clear and others that may well need changing. Huge challenges remain – not just taking on new claims but transferring the many millions on existing benefits and tax credits, including some of the most vulnerable on Employment and Support Allowance. Its generosity has repeatedly been cut.

“But the lessons from how it has been turned around from the brink of disaster to something that may eventually work could prove valuable for other government projects. And crucially, it now has a timetable that may finally prove realistic.”

Unrealistic timetables were blamed for the original scrapping of the scheme along with an unworkable mix of “agile” and “waterfall” project management approaches.

It follows a report from the Infrastructure and Projects Authority in July which upgraded the risk assessment of the programme from amber/red to red, when the programme was assessed in September 2015. ®

 

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Written by Andrew Coates

September 6, 2016 at 2:46 pm

103 Responses

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  1. ” one-dole-to-rule-them-all Universal Credit programme”

    Good use of a Lord Of The Rings metaphor.

    the jewel in the fen

    September 6, 2016 at 4:44 pm

    • My precious… my precious…

      Iain Duncan Golem

      September 6, 2016 at 9:20 pm

  2. But will it be a success?

    “The answer to that depends on how success is defined” & for whom.

    enigma

    September 6, 2016 at 4:55 pm

    • Universal Credit will improve life for any number of claimants.

      (Including the number zero of course.)

      Manny

      September 7, 2016 at 8:34 am

  3. “As Sutton’s experience shows, quite how ‘passported’ benefits are to be handled has still
    finally to be resolved. Universal Credit can, at the request of other departments, build in
    ‘hooks’ – the level of income that a claimant or family has to qualify for free school meals, or
    free prescriptions, or any of the other benefits that, locally, can even include fishing licences.
    Councils and the NHS can then use these as qualifying conditions for the free services. But
    precisely how all that will work at scale is still not crystal clear”

    enigma

    September 6, 2016 at 5:00 pm

    • “..hooks …”

      Universal Credit sounds like the IT equivalent of a malignant cancer spreading into other healthy IT systems.

      Manny

      September 7, 2016 at 8:35 am

  4. Page 87:

    “So it is a simple fact that this report can only be a partial account of Universal Credit to date,
    and one day, a better account will be written of its history so far, let alone of its finality,
    which appears to be many years off.

    Last line says it all – a success is it? And no one knows the completion date for the most basic of functionality. That’s like saying you’re baknig a cake, you don’t know how it will come out at the end, if it will be edible or even if the baking will be successful. ConMen Brilliance shines right through. ICT Professionals will be laughing themselves silly at this report.

    Gazza

    September 6, 2016 at 5:31 pm

    • And more Snippets – Page 72:

      May 2016
      All 700 offices are now on the ‘live’ service for single new claimants. The total caseload is 262,000, of
      whom 40% are in work. With an estimated 10,000 now on the digital or ‘full’ service, roll-out to five
      jobcentres a month begins, with plans to raise that to 50 a month in 2017.

      ME: So only 160,000 actual unemployed is on this rubbish,,,

      July 2016
      Theresa May becomes Prime Minister. Damian Green becomes Work and Pensions Secretary. The
      timetable is further adjusted, with contingency built in for the first time. Completion is now due in 2022 rather than in 2017.

      ME: Current completion date is now 2022… and beyond methinks…

      Surprisingly Page 61/62 clearly lays out the fails points.

      Gazza

      September 6, 2016 at 5:44 pm

      • I can’t see the majority on it by 2022 either Gazza, with the amount of people being laid off, it’s an every day event like those bailiffs,

        enigma

        September 6, 2016 at 9:21 pm

  5. Reblogged this on michaelsnaith.

    snaithmagmailcom

    September 6, 2016 at 5:47 pm

  6. Violet

    September 6, 2016 at 5:53 pm

  7. The rollout of the full digital service for universal credit has been plagued by errors, delays and computer crashes, leaving vulnerable families in debt and at risk of eviction, an MP has said.

    While we know this most people don’t.

    Tom Brake, the Liberal Democrat MP for Carshalton and Wallington, home to one of a handful of locations to pioneer the full UC system, has called for an overhaul of the service after receiving a regular flow of complaints from desperate constituents.

    Since May, couples and families with more complex claims.

    A defective pilot scheme is having a serious effect on many people’s lives.”

    Flaws in the online system preventing people uploading copies of bank statements and other documents needed to secure payments for childcare places, leading to unpaid childcare bills.

    We all know what DWP said.

    https://www.theguardian.com/society/2016/sep/06/digital-universal-credit-system-plagued-by-errors-says-mp

    enigma

    September 6, 2016 at 7:59 pm

  8. Be careful when at that first UC interview, especially the CC. & don’t go to it without any jobs search/applied for evidence, never forget they are out to sanction as many people as possible.

    enigma

    September 6, 2016 at 9:12 pm

    • You cant sanction someone on their first interview as they are going through the process of finalizing the benefit claim itself. Anything after that however is game on.

      I know they say you have to bring such and such but how legally enforceable that is at that juncture i cant say just yet as im still looking into it.

      doug

      September 7, 2016 at 12:05 am

      • Thanks for looking into that Doug,

        I know of a few who were told their first interview had to be rebooked because they didn’t have their jobs evidence with them at that first interview.

        enigma

        September 7, 2016 at 12:31 am

  9. With Iain Duncan Smith appointed as the man in charge how could so many things, so comprehensively, so often have gone wrong? Obviously people of bad character must have been working overtime against him.

    Mister Punch

    September 6, 2016 at 9:51 pm

  10. Financial Secretary to the Treasury on a tax service for the 21st century.

    Everyone will be able to log into their accounts online, at any time, from any of their devices.

    Now I know it’s not the case for everyone – and for those who can’t get online, we will make special provisions.

    They’ll be able to see exactly what their situation is – whether it’s about their income tax, student loan repayments, national insurance contributions – you name it.

    They’ll be able to add information on their income and expenses, throughout the year, as they go along.

    And they’ll know what they owe as they go along – not get any, nasty or nice, surprises when the annual tax bill drops through the letterbox.

    They will even be able to spread their payments by just paying as they go, if that’s easier for them.

    https://www.gov.uk/government/speeches/financial-secretary-to-the-treasury-on-a-tax-service-for-the-21st-century

    enigma

    September 6, 2016 at 10:54 pm

    • And our next project is a teleportion device, like the one on Star Trek, to cut the pollution on our roads. We have no idea how to do this at the moment but expect to have a million commuters using the system within two years. Lord David Freud (banker) and Iain Duncan Smith (wanker) will be acting as consultants.

      Manny

      September 8, 2016 at 8:21 am

  11. UC on track and heading for the light at the end of the tunnel, which will turn out to be another train
    on the track heading staight towards it. #UniversalTraincrash 🙂

    Another Universal Mess

    September 6, 2016 at 11:21 pm

    • AUM,

      I like the visual

      Gazza

      September 6, 2016 at 11:55 pm

      • Anyone want to take a stab at where this is all leading ?

        Why they want you all online, your data online, tollbooth the internet, make all money electronic, link up all cameras, all vehicles, utilities, and more.

        doug

        September 7, 2016 at 12:37 am

      • Total control of peoples lives.

        enigma

        September 7, 2016 at 12:49 am

      • Like robotics destroying manufacturing projects like Universal Credit, well, the ones that work anyway, are designed to destroy clerical jobs dealing with routine paperwork and similar. Anybody remember the promise of the “paperless office”? While in the real world were more up to our necks in paperwork these days than ever before. Universal Credit was a stupid idea, begun by one of the stupidest men in politics, which is and nevr will be fit for purpose or ever work properly. UC is screwed. The disaster will unfold before all our eyes over the next many years,

        Manny

        September 7, 2016 at 7:36 am

      • To make transactions more convenient, keep pedos and terrorists off the internet, find us easily if we go missing, improve the living standards of the poorest?

        The Gullible Family

        September 7, 2016 at 8:36 am

      • The jobcentre is determined that jobseekers are all on that universal jobmatch crap. If you don’t give them access to your account they have got a new wheeze called Digital Jobclub. It means you have to sign on weekly as part of a group and log on to your ujm account on the Jobcentre’s IADs (Internet Access Devices). They are so determined that jobseekers will have a ujm account and the DWP will have access to it. There is no stopping the jobcentre.

        Jobcentre User

        September 7, 2016 at 8:42 am

      • First i will answer Manny,

        Do you seriously think the employer was thinking, “great, less paper,im saving the tree’s” or do you think he was thinking,”Hmmm, theirs money to save here,cut back on staff,filing cabinets,office space,etc” ?

        The shock and awe i spoke of has been going since Thatcher and what was witnessed was a distraction, a misdirection of the true benefits of the computer. It was known day one that technology would centralize,capitalize and conquer. The single most passive,progressive weapons on the planet that could not only take a country but an entire planet.

        People mock robotics yet have you seen what can be done now, have you seen the all terrain bots just lacking weapon application, cant be persuaded, does not have heart and until it seeks to see that it is superior will follow orders to the letter.

        Gullible family while i get your choice of tag pedos and terrorists are among the hardest to find, they walk among us everyday so why exactly would you keep them off the net when the net is the most successful tool to catch them.

        What is a terrorist, an extremist gullible family, do you think it only covers bombers and people who kill ?

        It covers freedom fighters,passive insurrectionist, peaceful subversives,dissenters, need i go on.

        Are all partisans violently,are all radicals advocating violence,are all activists violent,are all fundamentalist ideology aggressive,when a politician opiniates against another politicians policy, say welfare is killing people,does that make them a threat to your existence, when this government bought in the benefit cap knowing it would effect many children but denied it would be the case, is that not dogmatism. Are not all these things in definition acts of extremism.

        Jobcenter user – Why do DWP need permission to enter an account when they are the data controllers of UJM which in accordance with the DPA is perfectly legal ?

        Open your eyes wider people, open your eyes as your not even scratching the surface.

        doug

        September 7, 2016 at 10:33 am

  12. Ministers warned not to cut national living wage rises.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-37286610

    enigma

    September 7, 2016 at 12:56 am

  13. Recessions linked to suicides and mental health problems, academics conclude.

    Economic recessions and policies of austerity have been linked with a rising number of suicides and mental health problems after a major review of scientific studies carried out mostly in Spain and Greece.

    They pointed to studies not included in the review which found an increase in suicides in England during the 2008 recession and another rise in 2011 following the implementation of austerity measures.

    not forgetting welfare reforms.

    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/science/recessions-linked-to-suicides-and-mental-health-problems-academics-conclude-a7228996.html

    enigma

    September 7, 2016 at 1:29 am

  14. NHS doctors are now being ordered by chiefs to ask patients whether they have private health insurance and, if so, to ‘gently’ remind them to use it. The unprecedented move exposes the dire financial predicament the NHS is currently in, and confirms that the ‘universal’ commitment of the health service is well and truly over.

    http://www.thecanary.co/2016/09/06/theres-question-doctors-now-urged-ask-patients-signals-end-nhs/

    enigma

    September 7, 2016 at 1:49 am

    • That sounds very American don’t you think ?

      doug

      September 7, 2016 at 9:42 am

      • It’s going that way isn’t it. one way or the other.

        enigma

        September 7, 2016 at 10:03 am

      • Not such a conspiracy after all then ?

        doug

        September 7, 2016 at 10:33 am

  15. They said he was mad for saying it, mocked him ,hate him, even some say he shouldn’t be allowed to come to this country.

    http://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/work-to-begin-on-big-wall-at-calais-to-block-migrants/ar-AAiA1HU

    DOUBLE STANDARDS DON’T YOU THINK ?

    No wonder government wouldn’t be drawn into that particular single topic of what this person has said but sort instead to skirt around it with character assassinations be they true or not.

    doug

    September 7, 2016 at 8:37 am

    • Welcome to fascism without fences as prescribed here on this very site ages and ages ago by a certain individual.

      This poster was lucky though as the forum visitors didn’t mock him, didn’t hate him, didn’t even comment when it was posted, no they ignored him.

      Funny how what some disregard, call a conspiracy just happens to become a reality, don’t you think ?

      (Before someone says, “its a fence though”, its not on our soil but its ours none the less)

      doug

      September 7, 2016 at 8:47 am

      • Mexico now Calais, where next,

        enigma

        September 7, 2016 at 9:50 am

      • You talking about ‘Gaia’? ‘Gaia’ who regaled this blog with tales of ‘inside life’ and how they once shared a cell with Charles Bronson – Britain’s Most Violent Prisoner lol Anyway, didn’t it turn out that ‘Gaia’ was in actual fact a she, a retired civil servant who wore a tweed skirt and owned a black cat.

        Memory Hole

        September 7, 2016 at 10:59 am

      • Memory hole

        Im sure if gaia was here being the truth seeker that gaia was that gaia would have shared equal discovery with those other like minded souls at the time, Mr A Coates,Obi Wan,another fine mess,enigma, tobanem, jj joop,etc who quite frankly would have deduced the same thing.

        I can only speculate but would imagine you were the poster at that time but who knows that tried but failed to prove gaia’s point as incorrect as lets not forget, its still very much the case as we speak now. The person if not you tried to character assassinate him like your attempting now, a very common troll practice not to mention they didn’t bank on him once being inside himself,then tried to lead the viewers away with how violent prison is which wasn’t the point being made as you know only to well, to which anyway gaia proved statistically your chances of being attacked were greater out of prison.Even i looked into that as it didn’t compute in my mind but sure enough gaia was correct as it turns out criminals and thugs feel they can get away with it more easier in a wider area so coupled with the fact the police are always the last to know and slow to real them in, in a lot of cases not mention many don’t get caught, i must concede its quite the fact,who knew or even would have thought about it but people like gaia.
        Anyway, then when they had nothing left like you now, kept repetitively and boringly so, harping on about references to Charles Bronson – Britain’s Most Violent Prisoner.

        Do you mean that gaia ?

        Oh, and if i remember correctly wasn’t it on this very site proved it was a he and not a she, does anyone else remember back that far ?

        doug

        September 7, 2016 at 4:06 pm

    • A small wall in a French town isn’t anything like a wall stretching along the border between to supposedly friendly countries. There’s no comparison, mate. Not by any stretch of the wildest imagination.

      (I’m assuming you’re referencing Donald Trump.)

      Two Thumbed Fist

      September 7, 2016 at 1:47 pm

      • Could you dig yourself half a hole two thumbed finger or is a hole a hole,a spade a spade and more to the point, a wall a wall and a fence a fence irrespective of size ?

        So now you’ve finished that hole,you know where you can place your comparison crap,theirs a good doggy.

        doug

        September 7, 2016 at 4:14 pm

      • Oh i wasn’t going to bother but what the hell, aren’t both ours and trumps intentions intended to keep certain people out and in doing so also keeping people in still restricted to the check point those certain people government are trying to keep out are meant to go through as tell us all two fingered thumb, if you tried to leave the UK and jumped over that fence and was caught ,what exactly do you think is going to happen Hmmm ?

        Do you think your wave your passport and french authorities will say,”that’s ok, you do that as much as you like”, do you ?

        doug

        September 7, 2016 at 4:24 pm

  16. Sports Direct to put workers’ representative on the board.!

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-37284114

    enigma

    September 7, 2016 at 10:32 am

    • Stop please enigma, just stop as do you know how a board reaches a decision, do you think these workers will equal the amount of the other side.

      If people cant work out sports direct have not,will not change then we are making victims of ourselves.

      doug

      September 7, 2016 at 10:44 am

  17. Ipswich activist in this picture of the London protest today.

    Andrew Coates

    September 7, 2016 at 11:51 am

  18. OT: Mention of Replacement of Human Rights Act

    ME: for all those interested in Citizens Rights… at end of BBC article

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-37298415
    “Justice Secretary Liz Truss casts doubt on prison reforms”
    .
    .
    .

    “And she confirmed that the Human Rights Act would be scrapped and replaced by a British Bill of Rights, but the UK would not withdraw from the European Convention on Human Rights.”

    ME: As this is linked with the Information Act, I think it is going to box in the Gov in forcing people to use, say UJM on into the future We’ll of course have to wait and see….

    Gazza

    September 7, 2016 at 12:47 pm

    • & the digital passport, which is planed at the moment “voluntary”.

      enigma

      September 7, 2016 at 4:07 pm

  19. Having all the time in the world to spend on a project doesn’t make the project feasible if it is factually impossible. Eternity would not be long enough to create a perpetual motion machine. Universal Credit wpn’t be realised properly no matter how much time and effort is expended on it. Only politicians and red top newspapers like the Daily Mail seem unaware of this self-evident fact.

    Two Thumbed Fist

    September 7, 2016 at 1:43 pm

  20. LETS TALK ABOUT INWORK CONDITIONALITY

    HOW LONG YOU WORK in your first job is (working pattern) whats relative not the hours you are PAID FOR.

    Many people don’t get paid breaks yet seldom realize contracted hours does not always match their start finish time.

    ALSO,

    According to employment law and this starts the moment you start employment PAYE.

    Daily rest
    Workers have the right to 11 hours rest between working days, eg if they finish work at 5pm, they shouldn’t start work again until 4am the next day. If your an adolescent worker its 12 hours rest. Its easily arguable legally when faced with the time the body requires sleep and the getting to and waking up that this must be continuous so cant be broken down in sections not to mention different jobs dew to physicality so energy expired and this includes the brain power confirms the basis of the legal argument.

    weekly rest
    Workers have the right to either:

    an uninterrupted 24 hours without any work each week
    an uninterrupted 48 hours without any work each fortnight

    (Ask your primary (so first) employer which one their contract stipulates, get this included if not on contract)

    DO NOT, I REPEAT DO NOT WAVER YOUR RIGHTS TO THE WORKING TIME DIRECTIVE.

    This means by law you cannot be made to exceed 48 hours a week and 40 if under 18.

    WHAT LEGALLY COUNTS AS WORK

    job-related training
    job-related travelling time (for example, if you’re a sales rep)
    working lunches
    time spent working abroad
    paid and some unpaid overtime
    time spent ‘on-call’ at the workplace
    any time that is treated as ‘working time’ under a contract
    travel between home and work at the start and end of the working day (if you don’t have a fixed place of work) THIS MEANS SOMEONE HOLDING TWO JOBS CAN LEGALLY COUNT ALL TRAVEL TIME FOR BOTH JOBS AS COUNTING TOWARDS HOURS WORKED IF BOTH ON THE SAME DAY. The law stipulates work and not works OK. THIS ALSO APPLIES TO PEOPLE WHO VISIT VARIOUS PLACES OF WORK while in working hours RATHER THAN A STATIC LOCATION EVEN ITS A SINGLE JOB like a field service engineer,visiting nurse,traveling saleman to name but a few examples that don’t start out at a single point like say going into an office to collect your daily list of visits to customers/clients. Most employers give out details the night before or via a database accessible at home via the internet.

    EXAMPLE – A person over 18 is contracted for 30 hours a week, 5 days a week, with non paid breaks totaling 1 hour whose working pattern is a 9am start and 4pm finish at a static location. (NLW £7.20)

    So our declared total is 7 hours and an unavailability not until after 4pm. As DWP stipulate you must seek work instantly for the purpose of calculating availability for the second job you can NOW ADD the time getting to your primary job so for the sake of this example lets say that is 1 hour.

    So now your declared total would be 8 hours for the moment meaning your primary is now 8am to 4pm. Now the 11 hour daily rule that must not be interrupted can either be before 8am or after 4pm.

    So if it starts after 4pm you will not legally be available for work until 3am in the morning which means we have to ADD travel time so lets say it takes 1 hour. You now cant start till 4am and must finish at 8am meaning the 35 dont have to search rule,just went down to 34 as who advertises 1 hour jobs.This means the second job must be and is only reasonably enforceable for no less than 5 hours BUT WAIT,
    who advertises 2 or 3 hour jobs and whats the chances if and when they exist that their only for one day as remember your only legally required to hit the 35 mark for in work conditionality to end.meaning it could be argued the 35 don’t search rule just went down to 32 hours and if legally accepted would mean is it not fair to condition in work people to look for 2 hours work, meaning shouldn’t the 35 rule be reduced to 30 and OH DEAR, doesn’t this just keep going on as a valid argument and justifies the total abandonment of such a required PERIOD ?

    THIS SERIOUSLY NEEDS A COURT RULING SO SHOULD BE CHALLENGED LEGALLY AS DOES IT NOT DISCRIMINATE AGAINST ALL WORKERS NO MATTER THE HOURS THEY WORK ?

    Lets leave that for now and return to the example event.

    So its obvious from a this day workers view that their not likely to get work in the early morning and even though i wont talk about it here introduces another set of legal conditions and thus distilling DWPs regulation still further. ANYWAY this means they can only work till 9pm to fit the 11 hour rule.

    This means as travel time is required they can only start work at if we say again it takes an 1 hour 5pm meaning they can only work 4 hours and OH MY GOSH IF WE DIDNT JUST RETURN TO THE POINTS I MADE REGARDING AND EARLY MORNING JOB, THE 35 HOUR RULE AND HOW IT EFFECTIVELY DISCRIMINATES AGAINST ALL WORKERS CLAIMING BENEFITS AS HOW IS ANY SETTING OF A BAR EVER GOING TO NEVER NOT BE DISCRIMINATORY.

    SO this means this worker can only realistically be expected to look for work on a day their not working BUT WAIT, your entitled to a 24 uninterrupted hour weekly break meaning this can only be one day for this person. If it was 48 hours a fortnight i would imagine they would NOT GET HIRED due to the fact the employer needs them every week so its definitely going to be one single day that they are off.
    So as this person works MON TO FRI that’s either a SAT or SUN.

    MARKETS KINDA SMALL DON’T YOU THINK TO REASONABLE EXPECT A PERSON TO FIND SUCH A JOB IN TODAY’S LABOUR MARKET FOR A 5 HOUR JOB and thus FUELING A LEGAL POINT STILL FURTHER BY ADDING TO IT.

    Incase anyone says you could take a job working more than 5 hours, that COMPLETELY DESTROYS DWPS argument for looking for work in the week for this person AND remember, if its reasonable for someone who works 35 hours not to be under condition then HOW is it reasonable to expect a person to look for more than 35 hours work exactly ?

    AND YOU KNOW WHAT

    I COULD GO ON WITH MORE REGULATIONS TO DESTROY IT.

    BEWARE, This is but one specific example so the lower down the hourly chain you are the less effectual working and employment regulation helps BUT reset assured these aspects still aid you, you just have to run your own sum to know how but generally it will aid in to some degree certain jobs your advisor may throw at you if they have not thought about it like i did not to mention as i said theirs plenty more regulations to assist,you just have to want to research it.

    MORE IMPORTANTLY THOUGH, IF ITS CHALLENGED AT THE TOP (30) AND A COURT RULES ITS DISCRIMINATORY AND THAT NO BAR CAN BE SET WITHOUT BEING SO THEN WE CAN BRING DOWN THE HOUSE OF CARDS FOR EVERYONE AND STICK IT TO DWP REAL BAD.

    ALSO REMEMBER THEIRS A TIME LIMIT TO THIS AS DWP LEARN AND ADAPT SO MAY AS WE SPEAK BE LOOKING TO REVAMP THE LAWS.

    WE NEED A SYMPATHETIC SOLICITOR WHO SPECIALIZES IN EMPLOYMENT LAW TO LOOK AT THIS SO IF YOU KNOW ONE, PLEASE GET THEM TO SPEAK TO ME OR WE CAN CROWD FUND AND THEN PAY FOR ONE AND BASED ON THE STRENGTH OF IT MIGHT BE ABLE TO GO TO COURT AND AT LEAST ATTEMPT TO TAKE ON THE THRONE.

    AS NO DOUBT DWP WILL SEEK TO WASTE MORE TAXPAYER MONEY TRYING TO DEFEND IT IF MY ASSERTION IS FOUND TO BE CORRECT.

    Please note i have not used every avenue to justify every scenario that in work claimants may use or find useful as im only using relative material to cover only the example i gave sound enough to justify various points and observations. You will all have to research your respective cases but none the less you will find what i have supplied above and below will aid you in part your individual situations.

    Source material
    https://www.gov.uk/rest-breaks-work/overview
    http://www.acas.org.uk/index.aspx?articleid=1373
    https://www.nidirect.gov.uk/articles/working-time-limits-48-hour-week
    http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1996/18/contents
    http://www.sleepdex.org/amount.htm

    doug

    September 7, 2016 at 2:13 pm

    • Thanks for this doug. I was vaguelly aware of the law on time away from work but did not know the specifics. I read up to the point about non-working hours. You are very correct at your conclusions. Further, does this not impact ZHC’s and DWP forcing people into multiple ZHCs? Oooopppssss.

      Gazza

      September 7, 2016 at 5:11 pm

    • Good luck with DWP changing the laws. This all seems based on scientific. Good luck changing human Physiology. Though I am sure Dr A Prik of Worklessness infamy and his ilk with give it the old college try.

      Gazza

      September 7, 2016 at 5:26 pm

    • THAT’S A BIG ONE! Ooooooer!

      Hello Cheeky!

      September 8, 2016 at 8:24 am

    • Whatever the truth of this matter, whatever the legal position, in my experience the people in the Jobcentre are pretty clueless, partly because the rules and regulations and targets keep changing all the time, and have a “shoot first and ask questions later” attitude. Since a “decision maker” has the final word on sanctions work coaches are quite happy to dole them out and let somebody else take the blame when they’re wrong.

      You can’t fight your corner easily even if you are in the right and usually get sanctioned if there is a “doubt” about your conduct. So even if you are on solid ground legally speaking a Jobcentre isn’t a court and the people you speak too are not lawyers you can argue your case with. If you’re not careful you will end up losing your only source of income for apparently stepping out of line even if you’ve done nothing to deserve it.

      It’s like a witch ducking from the middle ages.

      If you float they burn you as a witch and if you sink you’re innocent but die by drowning anyway.

      If you start acting smart and difficult with the Jobcentre they sanction you and leave it up to someone else to decide whether the sanction is deserved or not. I believe they call it “raising a doubt”. Work coaches will do this without a qualm because ultimately it’s up to Decision Makers whether you end up starving or not.

      Two Thumbed Fist

      September 9, 2016 at 8:25 am

      • Do you ever think before you speak two thumbed finger ?

        Right here in what you have said, you’ve just come across as an exact duplicate of a DWP advisor casting it in a way that your everyone’s friend, “i care about you people, i want to support you but i cant do so if you don’t do as your told”.

        Now as well meaning as you MAY be, your inciting claimants already victimized should just resign themselves to their fate and accept whatever DWP dish out.

        Do you understand what change is, do you understand how its achieved ?

        Take DWP for example, they went from passive administration to moderate administration to aggressive administration.

        So your basically stating its alright for DWP to change but not claimants if they wish to achieve a positive outcome which is to be treated fairly and honestly.

        When a product is broken and you want it to work, need it to work, you MUST fix it or bin it for a new one if you have no insurance. Now that product cannot fix itself so it falls upon the effected to make the change be it fix it or bin it.

        While i will agree most claimants are currently not best placed to defend themselves, it does not mean the tools/parts should not be available to them to attempt such just like every other product on the planet.

        Interestingly what a lot of product manufacturers try to do when they don’t want their product/service dismantled and repaired or perfected is to create a supposed barrier that cant be reversed. Sadly nothing can be overcome so ultimately fails.

        So ultimately you are in effect acting as a disclaimer notice covering the basic issues that arise out of the operation which if no one has told you, CLAIMANTS ALREADY KNOW thank you very much.

        Oh if your wondering why i often refer to you as two thumbed finger its because im giving you the bird as my logic is sound and why you or DWP cant get around it so come with these lame attempts of speaking without thinking first.

        doug

        September 9, 2016 at 10:16 am

      • A little knowledge is a dangerous thing and I believe you may end up leading the gullible astray, Doug. If anybody starts quoting random facts, which may or may not be valid, to staff at Jobcentres it will cut no ice with them whatsoever and certainly not prevent them from being sanctioned. It doesn’t matter whether you’re right or wrong because Jobcentre staff won’t know and couldn’t care less in any case. Who the heck are you anyway? Your spelling is awful and your grammar and syntax lamentable and so I would be surprised if you attended the College of Law and are a qualified solicitor, barrister, or even a semi-professional para-legal. You have a ridiculously high opinion of yourself, low opinion of anybody who disagrees with you or has a contrary opinion, and a preposterous proprietorial attitude towards this blog which you seem to regard as your own personal fiefdom in cyberspace where what you say goes. You make absurdly long posts that probably nobody ever gets to the end of and encourage people into risky behaviour, verging on the stupid, offering unsolicited advice to strangers so forcefully and incoherently as to be one hairsbreadth away from trolling.

        To be honest you come across as more than a little crazy, sport, and don’t seem the round schilling to me.

        My advice would be to get off your computer and get yourself a life before it is too late.

        (Or at least include a health warning at the end of your copious over-long posts.)

        Seriously, folks, if you want proper, authenticate and free advice go to your nearest CAB not the blogosphere.

        Two Thumbed Fist

        September 9, 2016 at 1:51 pm

      • Hmmm,” A little knowledge is a dangerous thing”, “which may or may not be valid”, ” It doesn’t matter whether you’re right or wrong”. You are indeed a perfect example of that aren’t you.

        Lets face it, if you and all the , how was it you put it, “anybody who disagrees with you or has a contrary opinion”, could prove me wrong, you would be on me like a baby on a mothers breast, yet here i still stand years later.

        The laws the law, that’s what i quote and you can check them up or ask a solicitor if you or anyone has any doubts in my claims but as i often post links directly to them, you might as well take the free option as CAB is quite busy and understaffed not to mention 25 min legal advice from a solicitor costs and why i get so many digesting my material in the real world if their unaware of it. Im not the only one to this site who successfully defends themselves and others and you know that as does those that read this sites content.

        Then theirs this continual classic troll behavior from you of character assassination, word trolling, trying to poke the bear insinuations,attempted yet unfolded accusations, blar,blar,blar, don’t feel i need to go on as the audience has heard enough to know you have no valid point to make as anything towards DWP you have prescribed they already know as why do you think they come here and to all the other myriad of sites doing the same work no to mention PCS who openly vindicate what we say as well as trying to change welfare for the better.

        You remind me of this offices staff i have recently been conversing with which is just one of a well branded agency. So conditioned, so lacking in individualism and will, they spoke without putting their brains into gear first literally every single time. Its a funny story, i may even recant it here if i don’t decide to use it as a piece for my upcoming but this in the works new pod/video cast im trying to put together as its quite common, not just in agencies but DWP as well to name but two places. So i do understand why you are the way you are, i even understand your misplaced feelings towards me.

        As for raising doubts that’s just the Indian call center trick used to defer blame and centralization of problem but you see a claimant can still make a complaint against an advisor simultaneously and that’s where “leading up to the event” comes into play, a requirement for all advisors to have to answer and you do this to legally discredit the advisor, the true catalyst to any sanction and thus null and void the “raising doubt” you spoke of in another post.

        Lastly as you put it and i did only recently explain this to another here on this very website, “proprietorial attitude towards this blog which you seem to regard as your own personal fiefdom in cyberspace” is the only thing preposterous as i made it perfectly clear i already have other sites which i am the owner so have no need to have more. So in parting im sure if Mr Andrew Coates the actual owner of this site had any problems with me or my contributions, that he would be more than capable of airing it himself which considering not so recently he actually used some of my material for a thread would strongly suggest that’s very far from the case but hey don’t take my word for it, why don’t you ask him yourself ?

        Have a nice weekend wont you.

        doug

        September 9, 2016 at 9:11 pm

      • Sorry slipped my mind about your comment on, “You make absurdly long posts that probably nobody ever gets to the end of”,

        Its better to be careful and precise as possible than to be careless and vague.

        doug

        September 9, 2016 at 9:26 pm

      • ‘Decision makers’ only ‘recommend’ a sanction! It is the ‘work coach’ who presses the “SANCTION” button 😉

        Deputy Dawg

        September 10, 2016 at 11:05 am

      • True! If you you present job centre staff with ‘facts’ i.e. legal documents, DWP responses to freedom of information requests, Acts of Parliament, Statutes, Black’s Law dictionary, jobcentre “toolkits”, they won’t look at them, they avert their eyes, deliberately and purposefully, almost as if they are trained to do so. They just point-blank refuse to engage! They will just ignore your pleas and protestations and continue to type up a “doubt” referral on their computer. The jobcentre is not a Court of Law; neither is it a properly convened, fair and impartial tribunal.

        Sheriff Sanction

        September 10, 2016 at 11:21 am

      • That can be quite true sheriff sanction dependent on office and advisor and why i advocate secretly recording them on top of a complaint as their not above the law and as a legal requirement to the civil service code they must adhere to, are legally obliged to observe and enforce all laws, never knowingly deceive a minister or a member of the public, nor misrepresent the department or central government they work under.

        https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/civil-service-code/the-civil-service-code

        http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1998/29/contents

        I say covertly so as any person, public or otherwise in a non public area must be asked for legal consent prior to any such recording be it audio,visual or both. This however is superseded if its done for the prevention or detection of crime or, to secure the apprehension or prosecution of said offender/s.

        You see entrapment is only illegal for law enforcement persons as you have just witnessed very recently in the case of a politician or did in the case of the Tulisa Contostavlos drug incident so despite signage im afraid DWP wont be able to prevent such material being submitted as evidence and used against them.

        Im afraid DWP la, la, laring as so to speak wont save them from any such decision being overturned by any official outside of their jurisdiction.

        doug

        September 10, 2016 at 12:45 pm

  21. LETS TALK ABOUT INWORK CONDITIONALITY (comes in 4 parts)

    HOW LONG YOU WORK in your first job is (working pattern) whats relative not the hours you are PAID FOR.

    Many people don’t get paid breaks yet seldom realize contracted hours does not always match their start finish time.

    ALSO,

    According to employment law and this starts the moment you start employment PAYE.

    Daily rest
    Workers have the right to 11 hours rest between working days, eg if they finish work at 5pm, they shouldn’t start work again until 4am the next day. If your an adolescent worker its 12 hours rest. Its easily arguable legally when faced with the time the body requires sleep and the getting to and waking up that this must be continuous so cant be broken down in sections not to mention different jobs dew to physicality so energy expired and this includes the brain power confirms the basis of the legal argument.

    weekly rest
    Workers have the right to either:

    an uninterrupted 24 hours without any work each week
    an uninterrupted 48 hours without any work each fortnight

    (Ask your primary (so first) employer which one their contract stipulates, get this included if not on contract)

    DO NOT, I REPEAT DO NOT WAVER YOUR RIGHTS TO THE WORKING TIME DIRECTIVE.

    This means by law you cannot be made to exceed 48 hours a week and 40 if under 18.

    doug

    September 7, 2016 at 2:41 pm

  22. LETS TALK ABOUT INWORK CONDITIONALITY (part 2)

    WHAT LEGALLY COUNTS AS WORK

    job-related training
    job-related travelling time (for example, if you’re a sales rep)
    working lunches
    time spent working abroad
    paid and some unpaid overtime
    time spent ‘on-call’ at the workplace
    any time that is treated as ‘working time’ under a contract
    travel between home and work at the start and end of the working day (if you don’t have a fixed place of work) THIS MEANS SOMEONE HOLDING TWO JOBS CAN LEGALLY COUNT ALL TRAVEL TIME FOR BOTH JOBS AS COUNTING TOWARDS HOURS WORKED IF BOTH ON THE SAME DAY. The law stipulates work and not works OK. THIS ALSO APPLIES TO PEOPLE WHO VISIT VARIOUS PLACES OF WORK while in working hours RATHER THAN A STATIC LOCATION EVEN ITS A SINGLE JOB like a field service engineer,visiting nurse,traveling saleman to name but a few examples that don’t start out at a single point like say going into an office to collect your daily list of visits to customers/clients. Most employers give out details the night before or via a database accessible at home via the internet.

    EXAMPLE – A person over 18 is contracted for 30 hours a week, 5 days a week, with non paid breaks totaling 1 hour whose working pattern is a 9am start and 4pm finish at a static location. (NLW £7.20)

    So our declared total is 7 hours and an unavailability not until after 4pm. As DWP stipulate you must seek work instantly for the purpose of calculating availability for the second job you can NOW ADD the time getting to your primary job so for the sake of this example lets say that is 1 hour.

    So now your declared total would be 8 hours for the moment meaning your primary is now 8am to 4pm. Now the 11 hour daily rule that must not be interrupted can either be before 8am or after 4pm.

    So if it starts after 4pm you will not legally be available for work until 3am in the morning which means we have to ADD travel time so lets say it takes 1 hour. You now cant start till 4am and must finish at 8am meaning the 35 dont have to search rule,just went down to 34 as who advertises 1 hour jobs.This means the second job must be and is only reasonably enforceable for no less than 5 hours BUT WAIT,
    who advertises 2 or 3 hour jobs and whats the chances if and when they exist that their only for one day as remember your only legally required to hit the 35 mark for in work conditionality to end.meaning it could be argued the 35 don’t search rule just went down to 32 hours and if legally accepted would mean is it not fair to condition in work people to look for 2 hours work, meaning shouldn’t the 35 rule be reduced to 30 and OH DEAR, doesn’t this just keep going on as a valid argument and justifies the total abandonment of such a required PERIOD ?

    THIS SERIOUSLY NEEDS A COURT RULING SO SHOULD BE CHALLENGED LEGALLY AS DOES IT NOT DISCRIMINATE AGAINST ALL WORKERS NO MATTER THE HOURS THEY WORK ?

    Lets leave that for now and return to the example event.

    doug

    September 7, 2016 at 2:42 pm

  23. LETS TALK ABOUT INWORK CONDITIONALITY (part 3)

    So its obvious from a this day workers view that their not likely to get work in the early morning and even though i wont talk about it here introduces another set of legal conditions and thus distilling DWPs regulation still further. ANYWAY this means they can only work till 9pm to fit the 11 hour rule.

    This means as travel time is required they can only start work at if we say again it takes an 1 hour 5pm meaning they can only work 4 hours and OH MY GOSH IF WE DIDNT JUST RETURN TO THE POINTS I MADE REGARDING AND EARLY MORNING JOB, THE 35 HOUR RULE AND HOW IT EFFECTIVELY DISCRIMINATES AGAINST ALL WORKERS CLAIMING BENEFITS AS HOW IS ANY SETTING OF A BAR EVER GOING TO NEVER NOT BE DISCRIMINATORY.

    SO this means this worker can only realistically be expected to look for work on a day their not working BUT WAIT, your entitled to a 24 uninterrupted hour weekly break meaning this can only be one day for this person. If it was 48 hours a fortnight i would imagine they would NOT GET HIRED due to the fact the employer needs them every week so its definitely going to be one single day that they are off.
    So as this person works MON TO FRI that’s either a SAT or SUN.

    MARKETS KINDA SMALL DON’T YOU THINK TO REASONABLE EXPECT A PERSON TO FIND SUCH A JOB IN TODAY’S LABOUR MARKET FOR A 5 HOUR JOB and thus FUELING A LEGAL POINT STILL FURTHER BY ADDING TO IT.

    Incase anyone says you could take a job working more than 5 hours, that COMPLETELY DESTROYS DWPS argument for looking for work in the week for this person AND remember, if its reasonable for someone who works 35 hours not to be under condition then HOW is it reasonable to expect a person to look for more than 35 hours work exactly ?

    AND YOU KNOW WHAT

    I COULD GO ON WITH MORE REGULATIONS TO DESTROY IT.

    doug

    September 7, 2016 at 2:44 pm

  24. LETS TALK ABOUT INWORK CONDITIONALITY

    HOW LONG YOU WORK in your first job is (working pattern) whats relative not the hours you are PAID FOR.

    Many people don’t get paid breaks yet seldom realize contracted hours does not always match their start finish time.

    ALSO,

    According to employment law and this starts the moment you start employment PAYE.

    Daily rest
    Workers have the right to 11 hours rest between working days, eg if they finish work at 5pm, they shouldn’t start work again until 4am the next day. If your an adolescent worker its 12 hours rest. Its easily arguable legally when faced with the time the body requires sleep and the getting to and waking up that this must be continuous so cant be broken down in sections not to mention different jobs dew to physicality so energy expired and this includes the brain power confirms the basis of the legal argument.

    weekly rest
    Workers have the right to either:

    an uninterrupted 24 hours without any work each week
    an uninterrupted 48 hours without any work each fortnight

    (Ask your primary (so first) employer which one their contract stipulates, get this included if not on contract)

    DO NOT, I REPEAT DO NOT WAVER YOUR RIGHTS TO THE WORKING TIME DIRECTIVE.

    This means by law you cannot be made to exceed 48 hours a week and 40 if under 18.

    WHAT LEGALLY COUNTS AS WORK

    job-related training
    job-related travelling time (for example, if you’re a sales rep)
    working lunches
    time spent working abroad
    paid and some unpaid overtime
    time spent ‘on-call’ at the workplace
    any time that is treated as ‘working time’ under a contract
    travel between home and work at the start and end of the working day (if you don’t have a fixed place of work) THIS MEANS SOMEONE HOLDING TWO JOBS CAN LEGALLY COUNT ALL TRAVEL TIME FOR BOTH JOBS AS COUNTING TOWARDS HOURS WORKED IF BOTH ON THE SAME DAY. The law stipulates work and not works OK. THIS ALSO APPLIES TO PEOPLE WHO VISIT VARIOUS PLACES OF WORK while in working hours RATHER THAN A STATIC LOCATION EVEN ITS A SINGLE JOB like a field service engineer,visiting nurse,traveling saleman to name but a few examples that don’t start out at a single point like say going into an office to collect your daily list of visits to customers/clients. Most employers give out details the night before or via a database accessible at home via the internet.

    EXAMPLE – A person over 18 is contracted for 30 hours a week, 5 days a week, with non paid breaks totaling 1 hour whose working pattern is a 9am start and 4pm finish at a static location. (NLW £7.20)

    So our declared total is 7 hours and an unavailability not until after 4pm. As DWP stipulate you must seek work instantly for the purpose of calculating availability for the second job you can NOW ADD the time getting to your primary job so for the sake of this example lets say that is 1 hour.

    So now your declared total would be 8 hours for the moment meaning your primary is now 8am to 4pm. Now the 11 hour daily rule that must not be interrupted can either be before 8am or after 4pm.

    So if it starts after 4pm you will not legally be available for work until 3am in the morning which means we have to ADD travel time so lets say it takes 1 hour. You now cant start till 4am and must finish at 8am meaning the 35 dont have to search rule,just went down to 34 as who advertises 1 hour jobs.This means the second job must be and is only reasonably enforceable for no less than 5 hours BUT WAIT,
    who advertises 2 or 3 hour jobs and whats the chances if and when they exist that their only for one day as remember your only legally required to hit the 35 mark for in work conditionality to end.meaning it could be argued the 35 don’t search rule just went down to 32 hours and if legally accepted would mean is it not fair to condition in work people to look for 2 hours work, meaning shouldn’t the 35 rule be reduced to 30 and OH DEAR, doesn’t this just keep going on as a valid argument and justifies the total abandonment of such a required PERIOD ?

    THIS SERIOUSLY NEEDS A COURT RULING SO SHOULD BE CHALLENGED LEGALLY AS DOES IT NOT DISCRIMINATE AGAINST ALL WORKERS NO MATTER THE HOURS THEY WORK ?

    Lets leave that for now and return to the example event.

    So its obvious from a this day workers view that their not likely to get work in the early morning and even though i wont talk about it here introduces another set of legal conditions and thus distilling DWPs regulation still further. ANYWAY this means they can only work till 9pm to fit the 11 hour rule.

    This means as travel time is required they can only start work at if we say again it takes an 1 hour 5pm meaning they can only work 4 hours and OH MY GOSH IF WE DIDNT JUST RETURN TO THE POINTS I MADE REGARDING AND EARLY MORNING JOB, THE 35 HOUR RULE AND HOW IT EFFECTIVELY DISCRIMINATES AGAINST ALL WORKERS CLAIMING BENEFITS AS HOW IS ANY SETTING OF A BAR EVER GOING TO NEVER NOT BE DISCRIMINATORY.

    SO this means this worker can only realistically be expected to look for work on a day their not working BUT WAIT, your entitled to a 24 uninterrupted hour weekly break meaning this can only be one day for this person. If it was 48 hours a fortnight i would imagine they would NOT GET HIRED due to the fact the employer needs them every week so its definitely going to be one single day that they are off.
    So as this person works MON TO FRI that’s either a SAT or SUN.

    MARKETS KINDA SMALL DON’T YOU THINK TO REASONABLE EXPECT A PERSON TO FIND SUCH A JOB IN TODAY’S LABOUR MARKET FOR A 5 HOUR JOB and thus FUELING A LEGAL POINT STILL FURTHER BY ADDING TO IT.

    Incase anyone says you could take a job working more than 5 hours, that COMPLETELY DESTROYS DWPS argument for looking for work in the week for this person AND remember, if its reasonable for someone who works 35 hours not to be under condition then HOW is it reasonable to expect a person to look for more than 35 hours work exactly ?

    AND YOU KNOW WHAT

    I COULD GO ON WITH MORE REGULATIONS TO DESTROY IT.

    BEWARE, This is but one specific example so the lower down the hourly chain you are the less effectual working and employment regulation helps BUT reset assured these aspects still aid you, you just have to run your own sum to know how but generally it will aid in to some degree certain jobs your advisor may throw at you if they have not thought about it like i did not to mention as i said theirs plenty more regulations to assist,you just have to want to research it.

    MORE IMPORTANTLY THOUGH, IF ITS CHALLENGED AT THE TOP (30) AND A COURT RULES ITS DISCRIMINATORY AND THAT NO BAR CAN BE SET WITHOUT BEING SO THEN WE CAN BRING DOWN THE HOUSE OF CARDS FOR EVERYONE AND STICK IT TO DWP REAL BAD.

    ALSO REMEMBER THEIRS A TIME LIMIT TO THIS AS DWP LEARN AND ADAPT SO MAY AS WE SPEAK BE LOOKING TO REVAMP THE LAWS.

    WE NEED A SYMPATHETIC SOLICITOR WHO SPECIALIZES IN EMPLOYMENT LAW TO LOOK AT THIS SO IF YOU KNOW ONE, PLEASE GET THEM TO SPEAK TO ME OR WE CAN CROWD FUND AND THEN PAY FOR ONE AND BASED ON THE STRENGTH OF IT MIGHT BE ABLE TO GO TO COURT AND AT LEAST ATTEMPT TO TAKE ON THE THRONE.

    AS NO DOUBT DWP WILL SEEK TO WASTE MORE TAXPAYER MONEY TRYING TO DEFEND IT IF MY ASSERTION IS FOUND TO BE CORRECT.

    Please note i have not used every avenue to justify every scenario that in work claimants may use or find useful as im only using relative material to cover only the example i gave sound enough to justify various points and observations. You will all have to research your respective cases but none the less you will find what i have supplied above and below will aid you in part your individual situations.

    Source material
    http://www.gov.uk/rest-breaks-work/overview
    http://www.acas.org.uk/index.aspx?articleid=1373
    http://www.nidirect.gov.uk/articles/working-time-limits-48-hour-week
    http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1996/18/contents
    http://www.sleepdex.org/amount.htm

    Just cut and paste each one as certain software is currently blocking it from being currently printed.
    THEN add http:// before it in your URL bar.

    doug

    September 7, 2016 at 2:49 pm

  25. LETS TALK ABOUT INWORK CONDITIONALITY (part ,3rd attempt)

    BEWARE, This is but one specific example so the lower down the hourly chain you are the less effectual working and employment regulation helps BUT reset assured these aspects still aid you, you just have to run your own sum to know how but generally it will aid in to some degree certain jobs your advisor may throw at you if they have not thought about it like i did not to mention as i said theirs plenty more regulations to assist,you just have to want to research it.

    MORE IMPORTANTLY THOUGH, IF ITS CHALLENGED AT THE TOP (30) AND A COURT RULES ITS DISCRIMINATORY AND THAT NO BAR CAN BE SET WITHOUT BEING SO THEN WE CAN BRING DOWN THE HOUSE OF CARDS FOR EVERYONE AND STICK IT TO DWP REAL BAD.

    ALSO REMEMBER THEIRS A TIME LIMIT TO THIS AS DWP LEARN AND ADAPT SO MAY AS WE SPEAK BE LOOKING TO REVAMP THE LAWS.

    WE NEED A SYMPATHETIC SOLICITOR WHO SPECIALIZES IN EMPLOYMENT LAW TO LOOK AT THIS SO IF YOU KNOW ONE, PLEASE GET THEM TO SPEAK TO ME OR WE CAN CROWD FUND AND THEN PAY FOR ONE AND BASED ON THE STRENGTH OF IT MIGHT BE ABLE TO GO TO COURT AND AT LEAST ATTEMPT TO TAKE ON THE THRONE.

    AS NO DOUBT DWP WILL SEEK TO WASTE MORE TAXPAYER MONEY TRYING TO DEFEND IT IF MY ASSERTION IS FOUND TO BE CORRECT.

    Please note i have not used every avenue to justify every scenario that in work claimants may use or find useful as im only using relative material to cover only the example i gave sound enough to justify various points and observations. You will all have to research your respective cases but none the less you will find what i have supplied above and below will aid you in part your individual situations.

    Source material
    gov.uk/rest-breaks-work/overview
    acas.org.uk/index.aspx?articleid=1373
    nidirect.gov.uk/articles/working-time-limits-48-hour-week
    legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1996/18/contents
    sleepdex.org/amount.htm

    For some reason certain software is blocking me from posting the source material so simply attach https://www. to it first, place the whole web address in the URL address bar above (top of your web browser) and it will take you to that specific website.

    doug

    September 7, 2016 at 2:55 pm

  26. IMPORTANT MESSAGE FOR MR COATES ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    Ive had massive problems trying to post a very long piece regarding in work conditionality i feel everyone may wish to read.

    Its strange as it does not effect other URL’s links placed on this site from being placed.Now it maybe one or more of them as theirs 5 in total.

    This meant the original one piece post disappeared some where. I tried again but in pieces and it worked up till the point i got to part 4.

    Part 4 took multiple attempts with different alterations in the attempt to get it to post without incident.

    As a warning as i promise you my intention was to never spam, it may well suddenly all appear in one big go and mess the whole parts attempts now posted up. With this in mind if it does could you please reorganize it as i feel its important that its delivered to your audience in the best possible way as it may well benefit them if not all of us in the long run.

    As usual please feel free to take content control as you see fit meaning if you want it in one piece then do it or if in pieces do that. If however as you have done in the past feel it merits its own page then feel free to use it as im sure its as far as current media goes although i cant be certain, quite unique so possibly an exclusive.

    As always please proof read it for any possible errors.

    doug

    September 7, 2016 at 3:12 pm

  27. Microsoft’s UK data centres power up cloud services.

    The facilities are located in London, Durham and Cardiff. They should help the US company sell its online services to the public sector and other bodies that handle sensitive data.

    The Ministry of Defence and an NHS trust are among those set to adopt the internet-powered products as a result.

    Offering cloud services from within the UK may help convince clients that their data is secure!!

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-37285667

    enigma

    September 7, 2016 at 4:48 pm

    • A paperless NHS.

      NHS: Health apps to inform patient records.

      http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-37290126

      enigma

      September 7, 2016 at 6:16 pm

      • We await the DWP going paperless, all evidence to be sent to UC via email.

        enigma

        September 7, 2016 at 6:35 pm

    • A few questions enigma,

      Where do the backup/s get stored meaning where is the archive servers, still this country ?

      Is this a master cloud or a slave cloud to the master and if slave,where is the master based ?

      Will only microsoft uk have access or will microsoft USA or where ever also have access ?

      If i so choose not to allow microsoft access based anywhere but the UK get access, will i get this granted,ie can i prevent my data leaving this country ?

      Can microsoft guarantee they will never get hacked, do they guarantee to instantly inform anyone violated by a breach including a mass breach straight away and if it pertains a government function like say my tax records, will either inform me as i prescribed ?

      If i say use a wordprocessing app like cloud office, do i retain the rights to all my material say if i was in the process of writing a book say and if i found my material elsewhere, can i sue microsoft at no cost to myself and if again it was media through one of our government departments, can i sue them at no cost to me ?

      If i didn’t agree with the microsoft policy, do i still have the right to legally not consent to it even in cases where my data is going through a government service. If i was to disagree with part of it would i be still legally able to say no to parts and still use it and or if my data is through a government service would i still have those legal powers ?

      Their is more but that quite enough.

      FACT – cloud technology has on multiple occasions been hacked already.

      doug

      September 7, 2016 at 7:37 pm

      • As for paperless evidence i wont let the cat out of the bag just yet but i would be very surprised if DWP covered all their bases.

        doug

        September 7, 2016 at 7:55 pm

      • When am I going to be let out of this bag, doug? MEOW!

        Cat in a Bag

        September 8, 2016 at 4:01 pm

  28. Work and Pensions Secretary quizzed on welfare changes

    Damian Green questioned on changes to disability benefits, Universal Credit and the future of the controversial welfare cap.

    http://www.welfareweekly.com/work-and-pensions-secretary-quizzed-on-welfare-changes/

    enigma

    September 7, 2016 at 5:23 pm

  29. DWP make me want to vomit.

    Marie

    September 7, 2016 at 7:16 pm

  30. The Times telling us what we’ve been saying for years.

    The report said: “Under nearly every stone was chaos. People burst into tears. There was one young lad from one of the suppliers who said: ‘Just don’t put this thing online. I am a public servant at heart. It is a complete security disaster.’ There was no way this could be launched as a digital service.”

    Universal credit poses a major security risk
    http://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/universal-credit-poses-a-major-security-risk-spies-tell-no-10-m87rs8qq5

    Another Universal Mess

    September 7, 2016 at 11:00 pm

  31. Academy headteacher refuses to back down in school uniform row after 80 pupils sent home

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/2016/09/07/headteacher-refuses-to-back-down-in-uniform-row-which-saw-police/

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3777409/School-gates-stand-father-one-fifty-pupils-sent-home-weren-t-wearing-right-school-uniform-vows-daughter-dress-today.html?ITO=1490

    Now im not quite sure what to say which is unusual for me so i will just let you draw your own conclusions.

    I also by chance came across this article.

    Disappearing Kent Headteachers

    http://www.kentadvice.co.uk/peters-blog/news-a-comments/item/693-disappearing-kent-headteachers-part-two.html

    Kent’s education sector isn’t having the best of starts of the great education reform.

    doug

    September 7, 2016 at 11:25 pm

    • On the way to military order.

      enigma

      September 8, 2016 at 8:48 pm

    • Test public reaction?

      enigma

      September 8, 2016 at 9:16 pm

  32. Widespread use of zero hours contracts a ‘key challenge’ for Theresa May, says RF.

    http://www.welfareweekly.com/widespread-use-of-zero-hours-contracts-a-key-challenge-for-theresa-may-says-thinktank/

    enigma

    September 8, 2016 at 9:59 am

    • http://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/news/number-of-people-on-zero-hours-contracts-jumps-by-20-per-cent-in-a-year-a7231561.html

      “Flexibility : Allowing workers to have no set hours. No defined income. No sick pay. No holiday pay. No pension.

      And the big business lobby say workers prefer this “freedom”

      enigma

      September 8, 2016 at 10:34 am

    • How will in-work conditionality work with zero hour contracts? If you don’t know how many hours you’re going to work how will you know how many hours you should spend work-searching?

      Two Thumbed Fist

      September 8, 2016 at 12:59 pm

    • Enigma

      The last government (cameron,osborne and IDS) liked them as they don’t have their own category so blurred the line on full time/part time and played to the lies they were spreading to justify things like in-work conditionality for instance.

      As i pointed out to all not so long ago, the ratio at which full time is increasing is smaller than the ratio of part time increasing (labour market stats) and why the numbers of persons holding more than one job has increased and so can in a way mask the part time levels when considered over a certain period of time and opportunity. Its evident now purely because hours in each job are lower. Sounds like America don’t you think ?

      PROVING GOVERNMENT KNEW WORK WAS BECOMING SHORT AND INSECURE ALL ALONG.

      Another thing that’s not obvious unless you look is the amount of agency workers who are self employed and under an umbrella company who are on just as less insecure hours. Just ask sports direct, they have loads at Shirebrook and that’s what they meant by “if they want them” as i explained recently. Your find at agencies its workers are either self employed doing short hour jobs if opportunities for a more are less under an umbrella or on ZHCs effectively and why the self employed option dew to retaining more income through claimable deductions is an option most agency workers take.

      By adding these together an absolute and TRUE figure can be formed that easily tops even what has been released in the media.

      As for DWP the without doubt, main provider of persons for these short hour insecure temp work (im not flinging mud here as that’s all the options they have usually with today’s market), don’t be surprised when as soon as they or you get your first one, the next they offer are generally miles away so hardly cost effective not to mention requiring a third job if your not lucky enough to have at least 30 hours as your primary job and even then still aren’t safe.

      I feel it was obvious in my recent post about LET TALK IN WORK CONDITIONALITY and maybe, your have to let me know, might answer your question Gazza you put to me.

      doug

      September 8, 2016 at 3:50 pm

  33. Number of temporary agency workers soars 29% in just ten years.

    http://www.welfareweekly.com/number-of-temporary-agency-workers-soars-29-in-just-ten-years/

    enigma

    September 8, 2016 at 10:03 am

    • Doesn’t this dispel the notion underpinning in-work conditionality that everyone should be earning at least 35 hours on the minimum wage? With a lack of full-time 35 hour plus employment in a casualised “flexible” economy, how realistic is it really to try to drive everyone into jobs like these via in-work conditionality and sanctions when enough such full-time positions genuinely do not exist?

      Two Thumbed Fist

      September 8, 2016 at 1:03 pm

  34. Despite Britain’s political mafia pushing years of austerity on the peasants, their gilted castle the Houses of Parliament is to get a £4 billion face lift courtesy of the tax payers.

    How the UK hasn’t had a revolution yet shows how tolerant and gullible citizens have of their evil twisted masters.

    Marie

    September 8, 2016 at 12:50 pm

  35. Universal credit is undeliverable: but who’ll tell ministers the truth?
    David Walker

    The project was bedevilled by a Tory determination to make the poor suffer the brunt of “fiscal adjustment” after the 2008 financial crash. Personalities matter, too, in the shape of former work and pensions secretary Iain Duncan Smith’s tendency to deny truths evident to everyone else, compounded by former prime minister’s David Cameron’s debonair ignorance of what his ministers were doing around him.
    https://www.theguardian.com/public-leaders-network/2016/sep/08/universal-credit-undeliverable-ministers-truth-poor

    Another Universal Mess

    September 8, 2016 at 4:36 pm

    • And who thinks its deliverable now?

      Jokers the lot of them.

      Meanwhile in DWP land the hijinks continue.
      a] told them homeless – that adviser deliberatley did not record it. Discrim date reset [they are so so dumb].
      b] told of meeting then, intiailly denied need to put it in writing, then given written rubbish. Letter not saved on their system.
      c] why rubbish? called dwp and got actual letter sent. It Is not the same as letter not saved on their systems.
      d] actual meeting letter supposed to be sent in post above – which surprise surprise for DWP, was not posted – had advisors name on it.
      e] said advisor had NO knowledge of what I was called in for.

      Ooooops.

      So the Moral of all this is check check check and never believe a word the Snakes say.

      Gazza

      September 8, 2016 at 5:56 pm

      • Sorry to here your homeless Gazza, i take it your sofa surfing ?

        As for the not registering the homeless part do this.

        Under the DPA the data subject (you) has a right to know what DWP have on you as regards personal and or sensitive. You have to make this legal request in writing but don’t as it not what im going to prescribe.
        You also legally entitle to have whatever is wrong changed and DWP MUST COMPLY.

        So go to this link which is ICO and follow the process.

        https://ico.org.uk/concerns/handling/

        JCP and DWP are 2 divisions and so be clear which organization your having problems with. Now if its JCP, once this is done, ring DWP on the general line to check what they hold on you being homeless as its very possible they don’t have the correct details if JCP never sent them. If this is the you can change it with them over the phone but if they dont repeat above ICO process.

        JSA – 0345 608 8545
        UC – 0345 600 0723
        ESA – 0800 055 6688

        doug

        September 8, 2016 at 8:56 pm

      • Sorry Gazza, publication errors dew to my system created program not behaving correctly.

        Corrections

        1:Sorry to hear your homeless Gazza, i take it your sofa surfing ?

        2:You have to make this legal request in writing but don’t as its not what im going to prescribe.

        3:Your also legally entitled to have whatever is wrong changed and DWP MUST COMPLY.

        4:JCP and DWP are 2 divisions, so be clear which organization your having problems with.

        5:If this is the case you can change it with them over the phone but if they don’t then repeat above ICO process.

        doug

        September 9, 2016 at 8:38 am

      • hi doug

        Corrections

        1: Yep – council will house me [health reasons] eventually…

        2: Okay

        3: Okay – I would point out for everyone else’s knowledge as your CC is a live document IT must be available at all times and is checked periodcally [though strangely not in my case, it along with everything else on three different systems just happened to “drop off”… I strongly suspect after someone hit the delete key, and even stranger no attempt to use backups until after wards to get only the CC back, like months later but nothing else. Oooops.]

        4: JCP

        5: ICO process, due to the ‘drop off’ as detailed above will be going this route – then on top of that we have the discrimination aspect.

        At the end when I out loud mentioned the discrimination aspect by management & individuals I was supposed to leave. The floor manager diseapeared. I hung on to politely say good bye to the advisor, good thing too, the advisor got a call to a meeting and looked very surprised. I wonder what could have triggered that? [yep, I can put two and two together – I suspect its headless chicken time right now there – I mentioned the Equality commission investigation into DWP/JCP and Witch Mays ordering of the same across Gov – I think that is kicking off the headless chicken actions]. And they are strongly suggesting applying for ESA – I pointed out the corrupt nature of how treated and they shut up/have no answer. And on top of that its been suggested I move to another area due to current homelessness [maybe to take the heat off themselves?]. I was pointing out and describing the individuals throughout. It gave me great pleasure to call the two most involved C#cks which they are.

        I did enjoy seeing the Floor Manger looking more and more unhappy especially when I pointed out that she’d backed the same manager who had kicked this all off.

        Oh and again my attempt to go over said senior managers head to complain – talk only nothing in writing. Strange that. Discrim Reset, Again [any action that supports said discrim resets the start time – they’ve all been under the impression its to do with disability until now].

        Once have an idea on Lodgings being sorted, then a few emails are going out and and bring the hammer down on them.

        Will they learn? Nope. So as my mother used to say “If you will not listen and learn, you will feel” and that’s not in a good way.

        Gazza

        September 9, 2016 at 9:31 am

      • Gazza

        Sorry if i told you something you already knew but i suppose the upside is like your posts, the helpful information is out their for others to use.

        Nothing like sweet victory don’t you think Gazza, i tip my hat in respect.

        Oh while i have your ears and that of others, i think you,me,enigma and Coates have been hitting some pretty big nails on the head recently as the trolls have been flying out of the woodwork.

        So with that in mind i raise my glass as a toast to you all, я приветствую вас людей.

        As no doubt just like America we will all be accused of being such soon.

        doug

        September 9, 2016 at 11:06 am

      • doug

        thanks – its always wise to reiterate information – you’ve and enigma/Andrew have brought up/reminded me of stuff I never knew/forgotton and people therefore also reading become aware of it. As from the film “Stitch” No one Gets left behind. It’s All good.

        I cannot emphasis enough the need to a] trust your instincts, if something sounds wrong, feels wrong etc, there is a strong likelhood it is wrong b] ask yourself the following journalist question using Who, What, Why, When, Where, How [With DWP: Who wants something? Why? How could it affect you? Who stands to gain? Why? etc etc]

        Gazza

        September 9, 2016 at 11:25 am

  36. Tax-Free Childcare scheme launch to parents – 2017

    Overview

    Tax-Free Childcare is a new government scheme to help working parents with the cost of childcare.

    Parents will be able to open an online account, which they can use to pay for childcare from a registered provider.

    For every £8 a parent pays in, the government will pay in an extra £2. Parents can receive up to £2,000 per child, per year, towards their childcare costs, or £4,000 for disabled children.

    The scheme will be available for children up to the age of 12, or 17 for children with disabilities.

    To qualify, parents will have to be in work, and each expecting to earn at least £115 a week. Each parent must not have income over £100,000 per year…………………

    https://www.gov.uk/government/news/tax-free-childcare-top-things-childcare-providers-should-know

    enigma

    September 8, 2016 at 6:30 pm

  37. […] Universal Credit “on track”, or Maybe Not. […]

  38. Errors in communications data use led to wrongful arrests, report finds

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-37309372

    Quotes of pieces of article

    “There were six instances in which people unconnected to the investigations were visited by police and seven cases that resulted in delayed welfare checks on vulnerable individuals”.

    Of these, 86.6% were attributable to public authorities, 12.6% to communications service providers and 0.8% to other parties.

    “Commissioner Sir Stanley Burnton’s annual report said: “Any police action taken erroneously in such cases, such as the search of an individual’s house that is unconnected to the investigation or a delayed welfare check on an individual whose life is believed to be at risk, can have a devastating impact on the individuals concerned.”

    “The report said: “This is of concern because a significant piece of intelligence could be missed completely or not reacted to promptly, leading to a serious incident occurring which may have otherwise been prevented.”

    doug

    September 9, 2016 at 10:24 am

    • There is going to many more mistakes of course, under pressure, rushing around. lack of sleep.

      We can all expect a visit one day.

      enigma

      September 9, 2016 at 4:11 pm

  39. Arrests over hacks of CIA and FBI staff

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-37316615

    If these people can be hacked and remember one HILLARY CLINTON, current running democratic nominee for president and former United States Secretary of State was recently to, what makes you think this wont happen to your welfare,medical and other personal and or sensitive data held by your government ?

    So what if they catch the individuals as the damage is done, the clock cant be reversed, the information is out their FOREVER to be used for whatever purposes a person desires.

    Stop the rot,change the tied,no one can protect your data rights better than a good old fashioned filing cabinet and a locked and alarmed building. Yes its still not full proof but its way less likely to occur and far easier to trace blame than digital technology.

    doug

    September 9, 2016 at 10:38 am

  40. Digital, many things if not all will fail in the end.

    enigma

    September 9, 2016 at 4:15 pm

  41. Ok.

    Here’s the S. P. on the JCP if they are trying to get you to claim Universal Credit as it currently stands..

    1. If you are still claiming JSA – Whatever you do please make sure your Job search is in order EVERYTIME you sign on. I recommend at least 14 to 16 job provable jobs every fortnight you sign on (i.e printouts) . (Anymore would give the JCP a reason to question what you have done)

    2. The JCP are currently engaged in trying to get people to go on courses. These so called courses (such as MWA or CWP or any other courses run by the DWP are now NO LONGER run or funded by the DWP).

    3 The DWP funding for the MWA ended as of 30/04/16.

    4. The DWP funding for CWP ends as of 27/10/16.

    5. Anyone who would like to question these dates: – Please contact DWP Caxton House London Tothill St, London SW1H 9NA

    Obi Wan Kenobi

    September 17, 2016 at 4:09 pm

  42. Now:

    IF EVERYONE IS LISTENING – I WILL CONTINUE,

    Should any JCP joke of an adviser try to CON YOU into starting a work related course:

    Here’s what you do:

    Print and show them this from the Govt. FoI: 2016

    What Do They Know?

    Freedom of Information Request Website.

    Department for Work and Pensions FoI

    24 March 2016

    How will mandatory work activity for claimants be provided after the contracts with external providers have ended?

    Work experience placements for non work programme participants are organised by the Jobcentre.

    Work experience is voluntary, unless the claimant agrees to participate.

    Note 1: The MWA scheme is prescribed as a work placement for and 7. and 5.22

    Note 2: Taking part in work experience in 5.1 under a work-related requirement remains voluntary but where the claimant has agreed to work experience as a work preparation requirement, they will be expected to comply, otherwise a sanction may apply.

    For more information see ADM chapters K1, K2, K3 and K5. 1 WR Act 12, s 16(3); 2 UC Regs, reg 114(1)

    https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/502453/admj3.pdf

    https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/how_will_mandatory_work_activity#comment-67833

    Obi Wan Kenobi

    September 17, 2016 at 4:23 pm

    • If you’ve got your ears on Obi Wan, do stick this on the latest article Andrew Coates posted as this work of yours needs to get out their.

      As usual its nice to hear from you, hope all’s well and thanks for the heads up.

      doug

      September 17, 2016 at 6:56 pm


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