Ipswich Unemployed Action.

Campaigning for Unemployed Rights.

Getting a Proper Jobseeker’s Agreement.

with 104 comments

More thanks to our friends from Haringey (which incidentally is Andrew Coates’ original homeland).

Signing on? Don’t let the Job Centre rob you.

This leaflet tells you how to get a workable jobseekers agreement (or claimant commitment), sustain your claim for as long as you need it, and resist the job centre’s efforts to make you destitute and prevent you from looking for work.

Staff at this job centre have been told to use illegal targets to stop the benefits of a minimum number of people every week. From the day you claim Jobseekers Allowance, they are your enemies. They will use any excuse, or none, to sanction (stop) your Jobseekers Allowance. They do this by setting you up with a jobseekers agreement, or claimant commitment, that is too difficult to sustain, and that will trip you up sooner or later. If you ‘fail’ on one occasion, you will have your money stopped for four weeks. For a second ‘failure’, they will stop your money for 16 weeks. Your money can be stopped for up to three years.

Don’t let them do it. If you are about to start a claim for JSA, go into the job centre with your own plan of what you intend to do to look for work, that you know is workable – read this leaflet for ideas. If you already have a jobseekers agreement, you can have it changed. Tell the person you see when you sign on what you want changed. They don’t make the final decision about it. If they won’t change your jobseekers agreement, tell them to refer it to a decision maker. They can’t refuse this. The decision maker has to make a decision in writing within 14 days to say whether they will make the change or not. If not, you can appeal.

In a jobseekers agreement, or claimant commitment, you have to set out what you will do to look for work. But if job centre staff try to put any of the following actions in your agreement, they are setting you up to have your benefits stopped:

  • They tell you to apply for a minimum number of jobs every week – how does anybody know how many jobs will come up? It will vary each week, from none to a dozen or more. It is good enough to say you will apply for every vacancy you find that you are capable of doing.

  • They tell you that you have to look in the same newspapers, or at the same websites, on every day of the week, or more than once every day. They’re waiting for you to miss one out one day so that they can stop your money. Websites and newspapers do not always update their job vacancies every day, and vacancies are always advertised for at least a week. You won’t miss anything if you look at each source of vacancies two or three times per week. Besides that, you need to have time to apply for the vacancies you do find! And time to attend any job interviews. Insist in putting in your agreement “I will apply for all the jobs I find that I can do”, and “I will attend all job interviews I am offered, and this will take priority above all other appointments.” This is necessary, because the job centre will sanction people for going to a job interview on the same day as they sign on, even if you tell them why you have to change your signing on time.

  • They tell you that you have to set up an account on the DWP’s job vacancy website, Universal Jobmatch, and that you have to give the job centre staff access to your account, so they can monitor what jobs you apply for. On no account let them monitor you. Their own guidance, contained in the Universal Jobmatch Toolkit, paragraph 56, says they cannot direct you to give them access to your account; this is the customer’s decision, not theirs. You cannot be sanctioned for refusing, there is nothing they can do about it. Besides that, you can use Universal Jobmatch without logging in.

  • The reason you should not let the jobcentre monitor your job searching activities is because there is a new regulation (regulation 9 of the Jobseekers regulations) which says that you have to spend 35 hours per week looking for work. This might be almost possible to do if there was full employment. But there is not. So, if you don’t let the jobcentre monitor independently what you do, they will have to take your word for how much time you have spent.

  • Note: If you are looking after children or a disabled relative, you do voluntary work, you work part time, or you have physical or mental health problems, you can reduce the hours to as low as 17 per week. (Jobseekers regulation 12) The number of hours you do is up for discussion (or argument) with the job centre staff.

  • They tell you to take a ridiculous number of steps each week to look for work. A step is any one of these types of action: looking in the newspaper’s job vacancies section; phoning an employer to get an application form; filling in the application form and sending it back; looking at a company website to see if they’re recruiting; phoning a previous employer to see if they’re taking on any new staff. Taking 10-12 steps each week is as much as you reasonably need to do, to have a good chance of finding work. If you are well organised, and think you will find a lot of jobs to apply for, you could agree to take a minimum of 20 steps. But if you’re asked to do more than that, they’re setting you up. You only have to miss one step out of 20 one week for them to have an excuse to stop your money.

  • They tell you to register for Universal Jobmatch, or put your CV online, when they know you can’t use the internet, can’t read and write easily, if English is not your mother tongue, or you haven’t got access to the internet at home. Jobcentre staff see people with these limitations as easy targets for sanctions. If you’re in this position, don’t be intimidated. If they try to insist on directing you to do something you can’t, tell them to read paragraphs 57 to 60 of the Universal Jobmatch Toolkit guidance. If they still insist, you insist on it being referred to a decision maker. If they still won’t back down, you can both appeal and make a formal complaint.

  • They tell you to go round a certain number of local employers every week to ask for work. –If you agree to this, you’ll have to insist on an end date because you will soon run out of employers to ask. But it is difficult for the job centre to monitor that you’re doing it.

  • Always keep a written record of everything you do to look for work, and make sure it matches what you have agreed to do. Keeping a record is a legitimate requirement for you to keep getting Jobseekers Allowance.

For more information about resisting sanctions, and how to appeal, look at

www.workandbenefits.blogspot.com .

Or contact your local claimant’s union, unemployed centre or anti cuts campaign.

NOTE (Ipswich Unemployed Action):

KEEPING A WRITTEN RECORD OF EVERYTHING THEY ASK YOU TO DO IS A VERY IMPORTANT.

We all have to present evidence of Job Search, and do a kind of ‘school assignment’ every time we sign on, so this should not be too difficult to do to cover what they ask from you..

Though personally it is a pain it is perhaps not a good idea, as some have indicated, to write,

“Went for job in Pencil Factory but I was not sharp enough” “Went for job in bakery but they didn’t give enough dough.”

 

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Written by Andrew Coates

January 16, 2014 at 4:20 pm

104 Responses

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  1. “The reason you should not let the jobcentre monitor your job searching activities is because there is a new regulation (regulation 9 of the Jobseekers regulations) which says that you have to spend 35 hours per week looking for work. This might be almost possible to do if there was full employment. But there is not. So, if you don’t let the jobcentre monitor independently what you do, they will have to take your word for how much time you have spent.”

    That bit is very very important indeed.

    Andrew Coates

    January 16, 2014 at 4:43 pm

    • Andy:

      Another part to this – on the front of the Jobseekers Agreement (ES3JP) it has a little box under:

      I know I must

      activley seek work by doing at least [ ] things a week.

      I am speculating but if this box has been left blank, any steps that follow should be meaningless and should have no legal standing?

      Obi Wan Kenobi

      January 18, 2014 at 1:02 pm

      • A reasonable way of putting this would be to just say:

        I know I must activley seek work. – and just leave it at that as we all know this is a requirement to claim JSA.

        Obi Wan Kenobi

        January 18, 2014 at 1:08 pm

  2. I’ve limited the DWP/Jobcentre access to to me as much as possible.

    I have denied access to UJM, I have refused to give them my phone number (inc. mobile), I have disallowed access to my email address and disallowed UJM emails, and have told my adviser if they want to notify me about a job they will have to tell me when I attend the Jobcentre or post it out to my address.

    I have had no problems for a while now.

    Obi Wan Kenobi

    January 16, 2014 at 5:26 pm

  3. good stuff!! keep it coming lot of uninformed individuals out there?!

    david john huxtable

    January 17, 2014 at 12:22 am

    • Credit should go to the Haringey people.

      It will be important to go into this whole issue of the 35 hours a week jobsearch.

      It is completely ridiculous.

      I spent time fiddling around with the UJM site this morning.

      It wouldn’t work properly, most of the time you can’t use your CV on the UJM and have to upload it again – which you cannot do in Ipswich library.

      It’s a bloody disgrace.

      Now you can only use the library computers for 2 hours a day.

      So what are you meant to be doing for the rest of the time?

      Trudge ther streets shouting “gizza job”?

      Andrew Coates

      January 17, 2014 at 11:43 am

      • Just read the introductary headlines on this post properly – quite right respect to Haringay people against the bloody DWP/IDS/GOVT.

        Full Respect to all the resistance fighters in Haringay – but also a quick mention to the resistance fighters in my own consituancy of Bradford, West Yorkshire, we are many but have no official forum – IUA is incredible – Andy keep up the bloody good work. – Total respect.

        Obi Wan Kenobi

        January 18, 2014 at 5:18 pm

  4. Good stuff Mr Coates but may I inject a little thought to this topic of access?

    Data protection act, part iv exemptions 29(1)

    (1) Personal data processed for any of the following purposes—

    (a) the prevention or detection of crime,

    (b) the apprehension or prosecution of offenders, or

    (c) the assessment or collection of any tax or duty or of any imposition of a similar nature,

    are exempt from the first data protection principle (except to the extent to which it requires compliance with the conditions in Schedules 2 and 3) and section 7 in any case to the extent to which the application of those provisions to the data would be likely to prejudice any of the matters mentioned in this subsection.

    You see a data subject (that’s you) forfeits their rights under the DPA if any of the above comes into play and these aren’t the only exemptions either.

    You may have seen lately which is dependant on how regular you enter your UJM account a notice flash up stating you haven’t signed in for a certain period, now this period or time calculator is not subject to prior consent and as such can be used against you.

    You see computer programmes are under the hood in essence math calcs so not only can the system say how long its been since you signed in, they can also tell you how long you were to name but one of the millions of things a programme can do.

    So basically your advisor could ask you a specific question or 2, then pass this on to compare it, if say they don’t already have that feature installed on the advisors UJM app, IF THEY DONT CORRESPOND,BANG YOUR IN TROUBLE

    Even without this as is clearly written in the act, PREVENTION, meaning pre or prior if you like. Ontop benefits are taxable so their another exemptions and quite frankly I could go on quoting exemptions that could be used to

    CIRCUMNAVIGATE THE LEGAL REQUIREMENT TO PRIOR CONSENT.

    So in the nicest possible way to all claimants

    ITS A MYTH IF YOU THINK THEY CANT HAVE ACCESS

    Im afraid the best UJM is NO UJM but this is only possible if the claimant can demonstrate that they are already using it proficiently which is, disincluding UC clients for now as I need time to study their rules, THE ONLY DEFENCE AGAINST A JOBSEEKERS DIRECTION and is clearly written in their rules of issuing said direction.

    How many claimants are aware for instance that this DIRECTION ends the moment they’ve shown proof of opening one, that its the agreement their after that stipulates a claimant must check their account x amount of times.

    Check if you like. but unless your agreements states you have a consent account, THEIRS ABSOLUTELY NOT LAW OF THEIRS TO STOP YOU CLOSING SAID ACCOUNT, MEANING THEY WOULD HAVE TO ONCE AGAIN FIND GROUNDS TO ISSUE YET ANOTHER DIRECTION.

    Then theirs the rights of a data subject

    THE RIGHT BOTH REASONABLE AND LEGAL AND IN FULL ACCORDANCE TO CONTROL THE FLOW OF THEIR SAID PERSONAL AND OR SENSITIVE DATA IN RESPECT TO BOTH SECOND AND ESPECIALLY THIRD PARTIES BE IT PRIOR OR POST TO (YOU HAVE MORE CONTROL PRIOR TO GIVING IT).

    DWP CANNOT STIPULATE EVEN UNDER THE THREAT OF EITHER DIRECTION OR SANCTION THAT A DATA SUBJECT MUST PART WITH THEIR PERSONAL AND OR SENSITIVE DATA

    THIS IS THE CLAIMANTS GREATEST WEAPON AS IT WOULD REQUIRE A COMPLETE LAW CHANGE.

    A CLAIMANTS NEXT WEAPON IS WHAT IS A CV?

    I kid you not I could write a few things about me on a napkin and that would constitute a CV

    This aside only recently I posted a post detailing how in the interest of security and privacy how a claimant could replace their entire CV with a note detailing to would be employers that for security reasons and in full accordance with the law have withheld my details,blar, blar, blar, meaning INSTANTLY THEIRS NO VIEWABLE CV,THAT FROM NOW ON THIS EMPLOYER WILL CONTACT YOU THROUGH YOUR SAID EMAIL ACCOUNT AND NOT UJM, this stifles DWP still further.

    And you don’t have to stop their as you can apply the same said rule to your profile hence why if still uneditable, your have to close down your current account and open a new yet this time without direction you show DWP the printout minus anything that would point them to locating your account but do remember and the toolkit backs this up

    DWP CANNOT STIPILATE HOW A CLAIMANT SUPPLIES THEIR EVIDENCE, MEANING YOU CAN WRITE IT DOWN ON A SCRAP OF PAPER,NO PRINTOUTS REQUIRED,WHICH AGAIN RESTRICTS THEM STILL FURTHER IF YOU HAVENT AGREED TO DO SO BUT REMEMBER YOU CAN REMOVE THIS BECAUSE OF SAID RULE.

    Lastly theirs NO LAW THAT STIPULATES YOU CANT HAVE MULTIPLE ACCOUNTS OR OPEN AND CLOSE THEM ANYTIME YOU LIKE AS THIS DOES NOT FALL UNDER CURRENT REQUIREMENTS AT DWP REGARDING CHANGE OF CIRCUMSTANCES,DONT EVEN BOTHER TO WRITE IN TO CANCEL IT,JUST STOP USING IT.

    Well I hope this helps as I can provide even more stuff to aid claimants that WONT MAKE DWPs day but as I said its all in the interests of

    SECURITY AND PRIVACY,SO ITS NOTHING PERSONAL DWP, YOUR JUST A VERY SMALL FISH IN MY OTHERWISE VERY MASSIVE POND.

    gaia

    January 17, 2014 at 8:33 am

    • “You may have seen lately which is dependant on how regular you enter your UJM account a notice flash up stating you haven’t signed in for a certain period, now this period or time calculator is not subject to prior consent and as such can be used against you.” – similar to when they ask how long ago was your last ‘work programme’ appointment when it is right in front of them on the screen. Anyway, jc can still direct you ‘register’ for an UJM account. Another thing, gaia, is that the jobcentre are like the Police (something you purport to have a LOT of experience) the more you ‘resist’ (assert your ‘rights’) the more ‘difficult’ the jc become 🙂

      Joblog

      January 17, 2014 at 9:30 am

      • Hello Joblog

        For a start its pretty evident or should be, anyone feel free, namely the sites owner, that this site is dedicated to fighting DWP corruption so it only stands to reason that this site is for those that wish to fight adversity and NOT those that just want to get their money and tow the line.

        For line towers, they use .GOV

        Now moving on, yes your right in saying they can direct you to register (this doesn’t include advice for UC regulation currently) BUT ONLY IF THEY CAN FIND THE GROUNDS I LISTED ABOVE AND YES THIS IS WRITTEN ON DWP GUIDELINES/TOOLKIT.

        BUT IRRESPECTIVE CANNOT STIPULATE YOU PART WITH YOUR SAID PERSONAL AND OR SENSITIVE DATA.

        If you disagree then please point to us a law that says they can and we will all look into it.

        THE ADVICE I GIVE IS IN FULL ACCORDANCE WITH THE LAW

        Again if you can demonstrate differently then please do as even in a police station, you CANNOT BE COMPELLED BY ANY MEANS TO SUBMIT ANY PERSONAL AND OR SENSITIVE DATA, INFACT YOU DONT EVEN NEED TO MENTION A PEEP DURING INTERVIEW EVEN IF ITS NOT ANY OF THE ABOVE TO BUT YES THEY CAN USE REASONABLE FORCE TO SECURE PRINTS AND DNA BUT THAT IS ALL IM AFFRAID SO SORRY THEY NO LONGER TRY TO BEAT THIS OUT OF PEOPLE ANYMORE.

        I must say it amazes me how people come to this site and state things like “the more you ‘resist’ (assert your ‘rights’) the more ‘difficult’ the jc become” as that’s TEXTBOOK 101 baby, in fact its already so known, IT GOES UNSAID, that’s how tired sad comments like that are ON THIS VERY SITE AND OTHERS LIKE IT.

        Look, I appreciate your concerns for fellow claimants but theirs such a thing as

        FREE WILL

        So lets, let the people decide what and what particular posts they read shall we unless YOU are asserting their IDIOTS,THAT THEY NEED THEIR HAND HELD, THAT THEY CANT MAKE UP THEIR OWN MINDS,CANT CARRYOUT THEIR OWN RESEARCH ON MATTER PERTAINING TO THEM OR SOMEONE THEY KNOW?

        gaia

        January 17, 2014 at 10:34 am

      • I have noticed with my ujm account that it DOES alert every 48 hours that you have done nothing within the way of searches for 5 days. I just now everyday re run my search profile

        philip

        January 17, 2014 at 10:40 am

    • Sorry people a typo on paragraph

      “Check if you like. but unless your agreements states you have a consent account, THEIRS ABSOLUTELY NOT LAW OF THEIRS TO STOP YOU CLOSING SAID ACCOUNT, MEANING THEY WOULD HAVE TO ONCE AGAIN FIND GROUNDS TO ISSUE YET ANOTHER DIRECTION”.

      IT SHOULD HAVE SAID IN THE FIRST LINE AND SECOND THE FOLLOWING

      “Check if you like but unless your agreement states you have a CONSTANT account,THEIRS ABSOLUTELY NO LAW OF THEIRS TO STOP YOU CLOSING SAID ACCOUNT, MEANING THEY WOULD HAVE TO ONCE AGAIN FIND GROUNDS TO ISSUE YET ANOTHER DIRECTION”.

      gaia

      January 17, 2014 at 10:42 am

      • Actually adding to this, even if it did as long as you give notice, you can still close it down and open another although I suggest opening a new one first before declaring it so you can slap them with a printout but do block any data that it dentifies either you or the account.

        If they wish to state you faked or could have this printout, then tell them to put it in writing and during the sanction appeal or direction appeal “your be happy to demonstrate otherwise” but also inform them that once you do, you will be closing that one and opening a new one. If they try to sanction you again and again you only NEED them to do it 3 times before it becomes harassment and that my friends is a CRIMINAL OFFENCE and lets not forget theirs a civil breach of LIABLE to.

        (Please note I strongly suggest you understand how to implement these in line with conditions set under the acts themselves before calling police or wasting money on civil pursuits as each case is or may be different so may apply differently or not at all in the case of the mentioned criminal offence).

        (Please again also note that this is a very heavy direct approach so should only be used where absolutely no resolve can be found between both parties after a reasonable amount of time. it should not be used as a tool to exact revenge).

        gaia

        January 17, 2014 at 11:10 am

  5. I have noticed with my ujm account that it DOES alert every 48 hours that you have done NOTHING for 5 days. I have too re run alerts

    philip

    January 17, 2014 at 9:20 am

    • Still gets logged im afraid Philip in one of the programmes datasets catchment files/folders so DWP would still KNOW.

      gaia

      January 17, 2014 at 10:46 am

      • Thanks GAIA, Sometimes however, I will delete said saved searches, As these are already logged on my profile, I go thru recommended jobs view thereby not getting the 5 day warning

        philip

        January 17, 2014 at 10:49 am

      • Philip:

        How to stop all DWP Jobmatch emails.

        Setting the email box to none (it’s set at 1 per week by default) will not only stop all DWP/Jobcentre emails, but I have found stops all Alerts on your Universal Jobmatch account as well.

        Since I marked the email alerts box to none, I’ve not had one alert flagged up on my UJ account and sometimes I don’t log in for weeks at a time.

        Here’s how to do it – follow the link below.

        http://refuted.org.uk/2013/10/13/jobmatch/

        Obi Wan Kenobi

        January 17, 2014 at 11:11 am

      • Again Obi Wan the data is still stored for attempts made so if it did form a part of ones agreement, the turning off of would constitute as a breach. Besides this as we speak their constantly modifying the programme like all programmes get modified so I would imagine at some point that this loophole dare I say It when its actually a legally installed function will no doubt get plugged.

        The trick is TO DISTANCE ONES SELF FROM UJM and this can be done legally and reasonably by replacing your CV with a notice proclaiming for reasons of security and privacy, this notice is now currently sent, that once you the employer/recruitment agency have been verified as a legitimate business/persons and trust built can then obtain in full accordance with the law my CV. To start with please now make all replies to the email address below as no correspondence will be received or acknowledged via UJM.

        (email address)

        The paragraph above shouldn’t be introduced as the notice as im only giving you the gist of what that notice need contain.

        Now from that point on the employer is now conducting their business through your said email account and thus in effect muted DWP from the dealings.

        As you can see you haven’t reframed from using a CV, just that in the interests of security and privacy you have developed a more rigorous and hardened security approach to the threats of online data theft which without the need for any links is RIFE TO SAY THE LEAST AND CANNOT BE DENIED.

        Don’t fall for that line of “why would someone want your information, who would be interested in little old you” as their not, their actually after everyone’s data, as much as they can get, so the defence to the question is one of indiscriminate data mining.

        I really wished I bookmarked it but theirs an FOI that states under no uncertain terms that DWP may not nor legally have to announce any major breaches to the system to those effected so as you can see theirs plenty justification to take a more secure approach to ones data.

        Ive spent a lot of time studying this UJM and have perfected some effective ways to lower or eradicate the population of certain fields and believe me when I say I haven’t even began to show you the good stuff yet that’s simple enough for even a beginner to I.T to pick up on, infact and im not being patronising its actually just common sense that any of us could come up with and probably already have and may be using it right this very second.

        gaia

        January 17, 2014 at 12:15 pm

  6. WEN U GONNA TEIL US WHO ONE THE 6 WEAKS GIRO AND 6 CRAITES OF ABBOT ALE IN UR FAIK COMPEISSHUN MR COATES???? DID U AND UR YOUNGE IMMUGRAINT WIFE WIN AGIAIN???? WEN U GONNA TEIL MR COATES?? WE R WATEING??

    a police officer

    January 17, 2014 at 11:25 am

    • Hello Wayne. Been ”Away”

      philip

      January 17, 2014 at 2:04 pm

    • Welcome back dog. Now, come on. Give it up. You have an adoring audience here who hang on to your every word. Oh, and how’s Waynetta keeping? I hear she’s up the duff, again. What are you going to call this one? How about Shantellian! Give it up dog.

      gaia's old nan

      January 17, 2014 at 4:14 pm

      • The british police are shining examples of fairness, justice, truth, honour, tolerance, spelling, and grammar.

        something survived...

        January 24, 2014 at 7:14 am

      • Anyone seen our gaia?

        gaia's old nan

        January 24, 2014 at 4:20 pm

  7. I would like some advice please many minds are better the one I find. A Local Market Employer is finding hard to meet the demands to deliver its goods and there may be a job going but I am not going to push too hard just in case it backfires don’t want to be too pushy. But let’s say they don’t want to take any body on right now but as I am unemployed I was thinking of asking to volunteer say five hours a day any sound thinking person would take my arm off for this to happen. I say this because as I am claiming JSA I thought it would keep the job centre off my back if I take this forward thinking on board and it could stop any mandatory work that may or may not come up in the near future as I am coming up to my six months post work program. i just want to get a feel of your thoughts on this it makes sense to me to do this or could there be any pitfalls to this.
    Thanks

    Mick

    January 17, 2014 at 11:39 am

    • Mick:

      Be careful as you now (according to the Jobcentre) have to do 35 hours a week jobsearching (Hah!) also it won’t prevent the Jobcentre from putting you on a 4 week MWA should they wish to as this will override any voluntary work you are doing.

      In other words volunteering won’t prevent a Mandatory Work Activity.

      Obi Wan Kenobi

      January 17, 2014 at 11:51 am

      • RED FLAG

        Notice the use of the term

        LOCAL MARKET EMPLOYER

        interesting terminology for a claimant to use don’t you think, not that im suggesting anything that is.

        JUST FOOD FOR THOUGHT?

        gaia

        January 17, 2014 at 12:28 pm

  8. Mick: – Latest on MWA’s

    From: Operations FOI Requests
    Department for Work and Pensions

    4 November 2013

    Freedom of Information request ‘Mandatory Work Activity procedures and guidelines for Jobcentre Plus’

    Mandatory Work Activity

    https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/182453/response/446137/attach/html/4/7.MWA%20guidance%202013%2010%2025..pdf.html

    Obi Wan Kenobi

    January 17, 2014 at 12:16 pm

    • Thank for that I was just sitting here trying to figure out how the hell can I reduce the pressure from the system even if I did go through with this they would want to take the lead and assert their authority their way and take credit when credit is not due. Living in Telford Shropshire its flooded with factory work but most if not all jobs are taken with agency work that offer shift work I would not let my Dog do. Having replied to 80+ jobs in the last two months not a single reply to any.
      One other thought any news concerning daily signing that’s what I’ve been doing for the last two weeks now and it sucks big time
      Thanks again
      Mick

      Mick

      January 17, 2014 at 12:48 pm

      • The daily signings are usually found when you get a real sadistic bastard of an adviser – it’s mainly to make sure you don’t have a job on the side.

        Obi Wan Kenobi

        January 17, 2014 at 1:51 pm

  9. gaia you have lost me?

    Mick

    January 17, 2014 at 12:54 pm

    • Its in my experience of frequenting sites like these and also being unemployed on and off NOT a word MOST used by fellow claimants as often the phrase is employer, reasons being its one word so is easier to state for time saving purposes, its direct yet still means the same thing, not to mention if we polled it, I guarantee you most will say employer, especially since the inception of texting and our love for abbreviation and slang not mention like the states, we to have our own version of lazy English.

      Getting down to your plight though, good on you for your initiative but rather than recant what what Obi Wan so correctly said I will approach it from a business analytics point of view.
      Before I begin please note dew to not knowing what this employer does, nor what position you refer to, I have to base this on assumptions ok.

      As you said this employer is failing to maximise his or her profit margin dew to a lack of staff be it one or many. This being the case actually puts you sir in a better driving seat if their claim is real as managers and owners aren’t known for declaring things relating to profit if you know what I mean.

      Anyway rather than pimp for free, why don’t you try this tact instead assuming this employer has the funds to actually pay a wage at this juncture. I call this try before you buy and it works much the same as business works when it supplies a service or product prior to funds being received, a very common business practice so would in particular unfold any disreputable intent should any exist.

      Basically offer to work on a weekly basis yet declare you will both agree that at the end of each week that you are assessed and that if you meet the desired requirement of proficiency that this said employer will pay you the national min wage for now so in the time being ignore current market wage figures for that week only and also agree if so to hire this agreement again next week under the same conditions. Now you do this both for a month if the job is say non to semi skilled, if fully skilled (ie engineering or the likes) its got to be at least 3 months but to cover most of what requirements they may have it could take as much as 6 months, it really depends on the sector and opportunities of demonstrating said requirements.

      This way not only does this employer get an avid potential candidate but you get paid properly for your time if you earnt it. So as to protect yourself just incase your being used keep the hours less than 16 so I mean nothing more than 15hours 59min, 59secs.
      To get around this should you or the employer or both require more hours then the employer must agree

      A: Not to instruct in anyway, you after 15,59,59
      B: Agree that in no way shape or form is he to announce to anyone that they will or might be paying for your service until after they have paid you which is perfectly legal from their stand point as they haven’t have they until they do, not withstanding that no actual agreement exists.

      This means it terms as SELF STUDY,HOMEWORK much like doing your neighbours lawn say because their your friend and their perhaps ill or injured so your doing it temporarily for free and its not a job, nor course. This does not conform to home study regarding attending a course, dont forget that as its important and believe it or not also counts towards time a claimant must declare when studying a recognised qualification.

      Naturally if their happy with your work and they pay you, you declare it, which if 16 plus more hours means automatically it cancels your claim so their not going to bother trying sanction crap which would be pointless as well, you’ve been working so that is the earliest possible time you could come in, remember you the claimant decides how to surrender evidence and not DWP, but like I said it will be to late for them dew to the automatic cancellation of your entitlement to JSA/ESA if you don’t stuff it up somehow during the process.

      If the employer doesn’t pay you then the unwritten contract is broken and that’s, that and you move on to the next.

      As for eligibility to actively search for work, well theirs 168 hours in any one week so even discounting 37.5 or what ever after breaks are deducted still leaves you 130.5 hours to carry this out.

      IF DWP HAD HALF A BRAIN AND THIS INCLUDES THEIR DOPY PROVIDERS, THEY THEMSELVES WOULD PRESCRIBE TO SUCH A PRACTICE RATHER THAN PURELY APPEASING THE INTERESTS OF BUSINESS WHICH ACTUALLY AS A RESULT ARE LOWERING THE DEMAND TO SECURE PAID SERVICES OF AN EMPLOYEE.

      gaia

      January 17, 2014 at 2:10 pm

      • Oh, I forgot to mention by taking you on be it the way I prescribed, Obi prescribed or even actually taken you on it saves them the costly cost of advertising that although their are free avenues, that this employer might not be aware of not to mention its time saving management advantage now this employer doesn’t have to wade through CVs and cover letters while taking time out to have to interview people.

        Just to more advantages you might mention to them perhaps ?

        gaia

        January 17, 2014 at 2:59 pm

  10. My Local Jobcentre Made A Mistake In Entering My Email Address. They Said I Gave Them The Wrong Address. Turned The Keyboard For Me To Enter Address. ”Oh You CAN Type Then.” One ”Skill” Added Then

    QWERTY

    January 17, 2014 at 2:22 pm

    • I don’t no if you intended it to be but that is very sharp and funny, I like it a lot QWERTY, a lot.

      gaia

      January 17, 2014 at 2:29 pm

      • Gaia:

        Look at your keyboard, find ‘Q’ then scan right = Q W E R T Y.

        Obi Wan Kenobi

        January 17, 2014 at 7:06 pm

    • That will be an interesting one to argue with them if one hand / one finger pecking typing is classed as a skill ie. I can type then they cant justify sending on a basic literacy skill course then .

      As obviously you can read / write * and most be somewhat literate.

      If your typing then you don’t need to write.

      letmein1

      January 17, 2014 at 5:33 pm

      • Maybe next time I’ll tell em I only speak ENGLISH and could I have an interpreter
        LOL

        QWERTY

        January 18, 2014 at 8:46 am

  11. OK, this one is for my loyal devoted trolls, but hey theirs nothing stopping anyone from viewing it if they want to hear a nice but poignant song. HOPE YOU ENJOY AND MAY YOU ALL HAVE A NICE SAFE WEEKEND.

    gaia

    January 17, 2014 at 3:16 pm

    • HAVE A NICE AND SAFE WEEKEND ALL – WATCH YOU DON’T SLIP ON THE SHOWER SOAP, GAIA 🙂

      The Prisoners of Cell Block H

      January 17, 2014 at 3:44 pm

      • Doing my thing at Woodstock 🙂 with Andrews Coates on tambourine 🙂

        Grace Slick

        January 17, 2014 at 7:32 pm

      • … this 🙂

        * contains strong language

        Rage Against The Machine

        January 19, 2014 at 2:24 pm

    • Think you will like this too, Gaia:-)

      The Prisoners of Cell Block H

      January 17, 2014 at 3:46 pm

    • lol 🙂

      Scott McKenzie

      January 17, 2014 at 7:21 pm

    • Hiya, check out my new one 🙂

      Terry Jacks

      January 17, 2014 at 7:24 pm

    • Hi I wrote this about a trip 🙂 lol to my jobcentre plus office:

      One pill makes you larger
      And one pill makes you small,
      And the ones that mother gives you
      Don’t do anything at all.
      Go ask Alice
      When she’s ten feet tall.

      And if you go chasing rabbits
      And you know you’re going to fall,
      Tell ’em a hookah smoking caterpillar
      Has given you the call.
      Call Alice
      When she was just small.

      When the men on the chessboard
      Get up and tell you where to go
      And you’ve just had some kind of mushroom
      And your mind is moving low.
      Go ask Alice
      I think she’ll know.
      When logic and proportion
      Have fallen sloppy dead,
      And the White Knight is talking backwards
      And the Red Queen’s “off with her head!”
      Remember what the dormouse said:
      “Feed your head. Feed your head. Feed your head”

      Grace Slick

      January 17, 2014 at 7:29 pm

    • “Music from the famous Laurel Canyon scene of 1960s California is the inspiration for a night of collaboration at Celtic Connections.

      In the late 1960s, a neighbourhood high above the centre of Los Angeles was home to a generation of musicians whose song-writing is still influencing bands today.

      Joni Mitchell, Jackson Browne, The Byrds, the Mamas and the Papas, Frank Zappa, Crosby Stills and Nash, The Eagles and many others inhabited Laurel Canyon and its counterculture hippy scene.”

      California dreaming at Celtic Connections

      BBC

      January 19, 2014 at 3:50 pm

  12. gaia
    Thanks for your reply like my spoken word I try to say what I mean and say it as is I’ve spent so long looking and reading many quotes, adverts and job profiles it’s left an impression in my mind.
    As for the job it’s a local market trader, fruit veg store my wife knows the owner and we have our veg from them and they are undecided on continuing with the trade as it’s a family store for some thirty years also family issues. Having said this I didn’t want to be pushy on this matter plus I want to wait and see what they are thinking of doing with their business and in a few days pop the question to them. All this is third hand so having to go through my wife for information is time consuming.
    Thanks for your input

    Mick

    January 17, 2014 at 3:18 pm

    • Hey that’s really cool and furthers your course and chances quite a lot if your wife knows them on a reasonably personal level. It might even be worth mentioning as they are having difficulties that if they do decide to take you on then maybe and this is your choice, that you would work without contract as apart from helping them out having no contract it actually means in legal definition that YOU CANT BE SACKED, instead you are sir LET GO, NO LONGER REQUIRED WITHOUT ANY CAUSE OR EFFECT, meaning it cuts out all that who ah around checking the circumstances surrounding why you left your occupation when claiming again not to mention BYE, BYE to cant have dole for so many weeks because you got sacked.

      I wish you lots of luck Mick and hope you really do get this job should they consider to maintain the business for some time to come and if you don’t mind me saying, im quite jealous of you actually, but none the less just wish you the best.

      gaia

      January 17, 2014 at 3:58 pm

      • gaia

        I think it’s about time you settled down and found yourself a nice young man.

        gaia's old nan

        January 17, 2014 at 4:58 pm

      • What about that nice police officer? Or how about The Helping Hand? Scarface, now he sounds like he comes from a good family.

        gaia's old nan

        January 17, 2014 at 5:00 pm

      • Gaia’s Old Nan:

        How do you know Gaia hasn’t got a fella, for that matter how do you know she isn’t a dominatrix moonlighting at Helga’s House of Pain?

        Obi Wan Kenobi

        January 18, 2014 at 1:26 pm

  13. Meanwhile, have you forgotten about the suppressed report on food banks?

    A Scottish report has boldly announced that “welfare reform is the main driver of increased demand for charity food parcels” – despite Government denials!

    Taste this excerpt from the Scottish report:

    “Providers who participated in the study [both food banks and “soup kitchens”] were in agreement that welfare reform, benefit delays, benefit sanctions and falling incomes have been the main factors driving the recent trend observed of increased demand for food aid”.

    http://www.theguardian.com/society/patrick-butler-cuts-blog/2014/jan/16/scottish-govt-links-welfare-cuts-to-rise-in-food-banks

    And by the way, I was reading today that since the year 2000, the average rate of benefit sanctions was around 78,000 each year. Now it is around 800,000 – and heading for the million mark!!

    Tobanem

    January 17, 2014 at 6:39 pm

    • An early day motion has been launched calling on the Government to publish the DEFRA Report on Food Bank use.

      60 MPs have already signed it. Tell your own MP about it. You can see it here:

      http://www.parliament.uk/edm/2013-14/928

      Tobanem

      January 17, 2014 at 6:48 pm

  14. RADICAL ROAD

    Here is an interesting page prompted initially by an early “work experience” scheme from the year 1820. (I wonder if it was voluntary):

    http://socialist-courier.blogspot.co.uk/2012/04/radicals-road-in-1820.html

    Strangely, enough, the “Radical Road”, built by the labour of unemployed weavers from 1820 is still in existence today, although it is closed to the public because of disrepair. Could it be repaired by the unemployed of today?

    Or would that cause another uprising?

    If the contributor called “Annos” reads this, perhaps he could comment more – it sounds just right up his street!!

    Tobanem

    January 17, 2014 at 7:09 pm

    • Look up “Bonnymuir” in Wikipedia!

      Tobanem

      January 17, 2014 at 7:17 pm

      • And this:

        I am the one in ten
        A number on a list
        I am the one in ten
        Even though I don`t exist
        Nobody Knows me
        Even though I`m always there
        A statistic, a reminder
        Of a world that doesn`t care

        My arms enfold the dole queue
        Malnutrition dulls my hair

        UB40

        January 18, 2014 at 2:16 pm

    • Annos is a girl’s name. It’s Welsh.

      something survived...

      January 24, 2014 at 7:20 am

  15. Oh how I long for the days when your signing on card used to be a UB40 and there was just the Unemployment Office, when the word Jobcentre was not even in the dictionary and to stop peoples dole money via a sanction would have brought the government down.

    Happy days – long gone!

    Obi Wan Kenobi

    January 18, 2014 at 1:17 pm

    • And this too: 🙂

      Red Red Wine 🙂

      UB40

      January 18, 2014 at 2:18 pm

      • UB40:

        When this was in the charts a pint of bitter was between 74p and 77p and a pint lager was between 79p and 82p – good times.

        Obi Wan Kenobi

        January 18, 2014 at 2:37 pm

      • UB40:

        Next time you post a video from Youtube, wait until the ad has played out and the video starts or copy and paste from the address bar – that way no ad is included.

        Obi Wan Kenobi

        January 18, 2014 at 3:30 pm

    • Obi

      You reminisce about the recent past. I don’t believe the 1820s were exactly “happy days”!!

      The future doesn’t bring much cheer either, at least according to Orwell, whose grim metaphor of the future is: “A giant boot stamping on your face, forever”.

      Well, there’s no time like the present!!!

      Tobanem

      January 18, 2014 at 2:34 pm

      • Tobanem:

        I’m talking about the mid 1980’s not 1820 – I’m not a dinosaur you know!

        Obi Wan Kenobi

        January 18, 2014 at 2:40 pm

  16. We have caught Top of the Pops – 1979 on BBC 4 for the past few weeks… and this is always at No 1 lol

    There is no pay at the YMCA
    There is no pay at the Y-M-C-A lol 🙂

    Village People

    January 18, 2014 at 3:27 pm

    • This video is usually avoided unless your coming out mate!

      Obi Wan Kenobi

      January 18, 2014 at 3:32 pm

    • Young man if you are down on your luck
      We will send you to MAN-DA-TORY WORK AC-TIV-ITY
      And young man
      If you don’t turn up we will STOP-YOUR-MONEY

      There is no pay at the YMCA
      There is no pay at the Y-M-C-A

      You can work all day
      You can work all night
      You can work your fingers to the bone

      There is no pay at the YMCA
      There is no pay at the Y-M-C-A

      There is no pay at the YMCA
      There is no pay at the Y-M-C-A

      You can work all day
      You can work all night
      You can work your fingers to the bone

      There is no pay at the YMCA
      There is no pay at the Y-M-C-A

      There is no pay at the YMCA
      There is no pay at the Y-M-C-A

      Village People

      January 18, 2014 at 7:58 pm

  17. We need an 80s revival (including beer prices) lol

    This is supposed to be the ‘perfect pop song’ – discuss lol 🙂

    A-ha – Take on Me

    Pop Pickers

    January 18, 2014 at 3:45 pm

    • This video is for totally for dreamers who think music video’s are real life!

      Obi Wan Kenobi

      January 18, 2014 at 4:10 pm

    • “The flickering, comic book-style animation of 1985 video Take On Me, by Norwegian trio A-ha, was a defining moment in the history of music promos.

      Twenty-five years after the song entered the UK top 40, the combination of quirky video and insanely catchy song – driven by Magne Furuholmen’s killer keyboard hook – remains the perfect pop package.”

      Taking on A-ha classic

      BBC

      January 19, 2014 at 1:01 pm

  18. And this was on Family Guy lol

    Toto – Africa

    Pop Pickers

    January 18, 2014 at 3:47 pm

    • This one is for Ex- Metalheads who are too old to headbang anymore!

      Obi Wan Kenobi

      January 18, 2014 at 4:12 pm

    • I masturbate down in Africa lol 🙂

      Hard of Hearing

      January 19, 2014 at 10:20 am

  19. jobcentreplus – You can checkout any time you like,
    But you can never leave! lol 🙂

    Pop Pickers

    January 18, 2014 at 3:49 pm

    • This one is an excellent video by the Eagles – however trying to catch up on old times won’t help you now!

      Obi Wan Kenobi

      January 18, 2014 at 4:14 pm

  20. Never mind blowin’ in the wind – what about the wind of change lol!

    Pop Pickers

    January 18, 2014 at 3:53 pm

  21. Someone’s getting happy on music video’s – please delete non relevant video’s as I know this takes up a lot of server hard drive space and this forum is mainly for conversation, the odd video now and again for relevant subject matter is ok, but using this forum as a music video hosting site is not in the interests of the unempolyed or disabled people as a vital infomation source.

    If you find a relevant video to the subject matter then please post otherwise ‘Fuck Off’.

    Obi Wan Kenobi

    January 18, 2014 at 4:00 pm

  22. And the jcp’s infamous Stairway to Heaven 🙂

    Pop Pickers

    January 18, 2014 at 4:02 pm

  23. Pop Pickers:

    Haven’t you heard of KPop – the hottest ladies singing groups of the orient on Youtube – no one in their right minds would turn the likes of Rania, Girl’s Day and 2NE 1 down! – they make all our female western music look like it’s standing still!

    Obi Wan Kenobi

    January 18, 2014 at 4:22 pm

    • Pop Pickers: – here’s an example by Oriental group (South Korean) ‘Brown Eyed Girls’ the song is called ‘Kill Bill’

      Obi Wan Kenobi

      January 18, 2014 at 4:31 pm

      • Jeez Obi, that makes Village People look like SHIT!!

        Kid Jensen

        January 18, 2014 at 4:41 pm

      • Keeping things on topic 🙂 Is that Esther McVile on backing vocals, Obi?

        Short Sight

        January 19, 2014 at 12:31 pm

    • I like Taylor Smith, me.

      But on political music – which covers the unemployed’s fight – the one I like the best is this French one (with subtitles).

      Andrew Coates

      January 19, 2014 at 11:41 am

      • No prizes for guessing who ‘influenced’ this track 🙂 lol

        Tom Petty

        January 19, 2014 at 12:02 pm

      • Even the Losers Get Lucky Sometime lol 🙂

        Tom Petty

        January 19, 2014 at 12:12 pm

      • JCP security goon to Jobseeker: “Don’t come around here no more, whatever you’re looking for don’t come around here no more, admit its over” lol 🙂

        Tom Petty

        January 19, 2014 at 12:18 pm

      • Taylor Smith?! – you not mean Taylor Swift?

        Taylor Swift

        January 19, 2014 at 12:53 pm

      • Or did you mean me 🙂

        Taylor Dayne

        January 19, 2014 at 2:07 pm

  24. Jeez Obi, that makes Village People look like SHIT!!

    Trust me KPop is the way to go, if your into oriental hot babes, much better than Girls Allowed or anything we in Britain think as hot totty!

    My god these oriental women ‘WILL LETERALLY BLOW YOUR MIND’

    Obi Wan Kenobi

    January 18, 2014 at 4:59 pm

  25. If you thought that one was good, here’s another teaser to get you into KPop:

    This one is by an incredibly beautiful lady called Jolin Tsai (she is from China) the track is called Love Player.

    Obi Wan Kenobi

    January 18, 2014 at 6:39 pm

  26. An these oriental babe’s singing groups don’t have to get naked to interest any hot blooded guy from wherever to get us lads going – I’d say it work’s for all of us Guy’s!

    Obi Wan Kenobi

    January 18, 2014 at 9:22 pm

    • Too right, just say ‘No’… to giving the JCP access to your UJM account!

      UJM is SHITE

      January 19, 2014 at 12:34 pm

    • “Just say No” – lying in a bath naked lol What is that all about? lol

      Red Blood

      January 19, 2014 at 12:45 pm

  27. Hey, you forgot me 🙂

    Tom Joad

    January 19, 2014 at 12:21 pm

  28. Edwina Currie attacks food bank users by saying they waste their money on tattoos and dog food:

    http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/454730/Edwina-Currie-s-cruel-jibe-at-poor

    Has she seen the following story (remembering the Government has suppressed a report on the link between food bank use and benefit cuts:

    http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/454730/Edwina-Currie-s-cruel-jibe-at-poor

    Tobanem

    January 20, 2014 at 8:25 am

  29. random bloke

    January 20, 2014 at 11:48 pm

  30. Ian Duncan Smith naked on a wrecking ball.
    Eric Pickles ‘There’s Nothing Wrong With A Little Bump ‘N’ Grind’
    esther Mcvey ‘I’m a bitch’
    Nick clegg and a mirror: Anything by Ant and Dec, or possibly Jedward, on a loop tape until someone shoots him.
    David Cameron: ‘smack my bitch up’
    Vladimir Putin: ‘I’m Too Sexy for my shirt, too sexy for my shirt, so sexy it hurts’
    Solomon Male [homophobic pastor from Uganda trying to ‘hang the gays’]: ‘Outside’ [coming-out song and video by George Michael]
    nigel farrage: he can’t help it he was ‘Born This Way’
    Ann Widdecombe: ‘It’s not fair’ (Lily Allen song slagging off men who happen to suffer premature ejaculation, like it’s their fault)
    The pope’s new Spanish homophobic cardinal, who said it’s a disease to be gay: That song by rihanna where a guy fucks her on top of a motorbike; and with him as rihanna.
    Grant shapps: ‘Tease me’ (till I lose control, take all my body and soul, oh girl)
    Simon Cowell: ‘They call me Mr Boombastic’
    The lady that did the style advice leaflets for jobseekers at job interviews: ‘Barbie Girl’
    Duet by Vladimir Putin and Solomon Male; ‘Je t’aime… Moi non plus’ (with sound effects)
    ditto: ‘And I Will Always Love You’
    ditto: ‘Gettin Jiggy with It’
    ditto: ‘love Shack’
    Nick Griffin: ‘Ebony and Ivory’ (or possibly not)
    A loop tape of David Cameron being forced to fuck a pig, on an 8ft flatscreen HD TV in every jobcentre in the land, with massive speakers; to a soundtrack of either the backing muzak from Babestation, or ’embraceable You’, or some kind of slow/romantic or fast/loud compilation of ‘music to shag to’. Like speeded up and to ‘Cotton Eye Joe’ by the Rednex.
    What was that rock song that goes ‘I want to fuck you like an animal’?
    Anyway to make conditions marginally more tolerable for the jobseekers.
    Michael Gove: That traditional old school song, ‘Nobody loves me, everybody hates me, I’m going in the garden to eat worms’.

    The Polish People’s Tractor Collective and IDS-Demolition Fund;
    The Worzels’ ‘I’ve Got A Brand New Combine Harvester’, sung in Polish.

    something survived...

    January 24, 2014 at 7:56 am

  31. Hi, yesterday our JCP adviser [joint claim JSA Harlesden JCP] told us that he wants to add a new paragraph of something to our jobseekers agreement and therefore he wants us to sign a new one.

    I managed to delay it until our next signing-on date.

    In talking by way of chatting, he says that our new jobseekers agreement will say that we agree to participate in any JCP initiatives that will help us to get into employment.

    Our jobcentre adviser has been away on ‘training’ for the last two times that we went to sign on, so yesterday was the first fortnight he has signed us on since he came back from his ‘training’ and he did say to us that it is mandatory requirement upon us to sign this new jobseeker’s agreement that he wants to add a new paragraph to.

    [Note: we’re long-term unemployed and returned back to the JCP after being on the Work Programme for two years with Reed in Partnership in Harlesden. We know that we are a priority for actions to get us sanctioned. We have always presented them with our jobsearch forms and these have never been criticized by the JCP advisor as yet…. but to be honest, they seem to ignore our forms most fortnights, they don’t look at them for more than five seconds in our case.]

    It may be that issuing a mandatory direction that they need to change everyone’s jobseekers’ agreements to include this new paragraph is something that was part of his training this last month… it sounds to me like a very generalized clause that will catch us out for sure. Other than delaying tactics is it reasonable to accept this new clause into our jobseekers’ agreement?

    conchita

    February 25, 2014 at 11:55 am

  32. I worked for the job centre until January 2014. They dismissed me after 15 years good service. I’m now taking them to court for ‘Unfair Dismissal”. I’ve already had one hearing and .’Senior Management’ lied unashamedly to the judge !
    They treat their staff and customers like shit, Staff are being constantly threatened and badgered to stop claimants money. I was repeatedly being ‘told off’for never having ever stopped anyone’s money. And yes they do get claimants to sign on daily because they suspect them of working on the side.
    This site is brilliant. Well done !
    And I can’t wait for my day in court with the evil bastards !

    MARIGOLD1

    January 6, 2015 at 7:29 pm

    • If you win your case, would you return to the jobcentre?

      enigma

      January 6, 2015 at 8:57 pm

    • You don’t sound as if you would but who want’s to be a criminal jobseeker.

      enigma

      January 6, 2015 at 9:22 pm

  33. Jobcentre Plus Mystery Shopper initial assignment should be complete tomorrow. Expect a new post about it by the end of the week or early next week.

    Universal Jobmatch

    January 6, 2015 at 10:09 pm


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