Ipswich Unemployed Action.

Campaigning for Unemployed Rights.

Changes to be announced to Signing-On: Workfare is Coming.

with 185 comments

There’s Money to be made out of Workfare!

This week people signing-on will have received (at least we did in Ipswich) a little note telling us that “restructuring” of these arrangements will be soon under way.

That we will be “required” to attend an “information” meeting on the changes.

To get a flavour of what these ‘changes’ may involve today johnny void   reveals today  (via Refuted) that,

“6 month Community Workfare: Commercial competition opens for business.”

As the Void says, “This new scheme represents 780 hours unpaid work, over two and a half times higher than the maximum community service penalty that can be handed out by the courts.  And this is just for the crime of being unable to find a job.”

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Written by Andrew Coates

October 25, 2013 at 10:04 am

185 Responses

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  1. Mr Coates wrote on another thread.

    “Will post in more detail, but there is some very bad news coming out for us lot in a few weeks time.”

    Is this the news Mr Coates or is there more to come in 2 weeks time?

    chris

    October 25, 2013 at 10:28 am

    • Yes, as far as I know.

      Andrew Coates

      October 25, 2013 at 3:58 pm

  2. WELL MR COATES IS THIS THE VERY VERY BAD NOOZ ALLREEDY POASTED ON ENIMIE JOHNNY VOIDS SIGHT?? TELL NOW MR COATES!!

    a police officer

    October 25, 2013 at 10:34 am

  3. Funny feeling this isn’t “it”
    We knew a couple weeks back the tories were making another workfare push to stick a dummy in the taxpayers alliance’ mouth

    random guy

    October 25, 2013 at 10:43 am

  4. This is just what the Tory led coalition government want. The Tories nicked and sold off everything in the 1980s and 90s. Now we are faced with a country where the only thing that is prospering are companies who leech off the misfortunes of others. The likes of A4E, Seetec and the other poverty pimps out there. The only growth in this shit ridden country at the moment is poverty, although the manipulation of the unemployment figures seems to suggest otherwise.

    A return to Victorian times isn’t too far away now – the only difference being that the work houses will be run for a profit rather than to help the needy.

    Chris

    October 25, 2013 at 10:43 am

    • Serco boss just resigned. (Tags for people out of the country or dead; also workfare, nuclear, defence induistries)

      http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-24672344

      something survived...

      October 25, 2013 at 4:25 pm

    • Your spot on Chris, the conservatives are all for businesses and as the saying goes “big money always floats to the top”.

      Maybe we should all pull together as a national placement company as our self employment idea and tender for the contract. Think about it, we all come from different areas so can easily compete on the national level like serco or A4E.

      gaia

      October 26, 2013 at 8:32 am

  5. Maybe the Torys will make signing on a criminal offence, so they justify giving people community order sentences. What next? Flogging the poor in the local square.

    Essence of Scouse

    October 25, 2013 at 11:21 am

    • Shaving the heads of the unemployed and a trip on a bus to the gas chambers maybe?

      Slave labour was made illegal over here years ago yet it’s perfectly ok for the government to impose it for a paltry £71 per week. If they want to end the ‘something for nothing’ culture they should at least ensure that if there’s work to be done, it should at least pay the minimum wage to give those doing it some sense of pride in the fact they are earning rather than a feeling of despair and failure for going out and working for starvation rate benefits.

      Chris

      October 25, 2013 at 11:51 am

      • 780 hours of community service? You can get 100 hours as a sentence for some pretty serious crimes. What would you have to do to get 780 hours? Mug an old lady and push her over, breaking her hip? Set fire to a cat?
        Even racists and hate criminals can be handed down silly sentences like 100 or 250 hours. This seems to be saying we are worse than muggers, racists, antisocial thugs, football hooligans, vandals, pervs who steal people’s underwear so they can wank on it…. Some serious sex crimes have been known to result in sentences like 45 or 50 hours.

        I reckon we ought to challenge this in court as being illegal. Being poor is not a crime.

        Being David Cameron or IDS, well that’s another matter entirely.

        something survived...

        October 25, 2013 at 4:38 pm

      • Actually under the Forced Labour Convention its not considered FORCED LABOUR (slavery) if

        Any work or service which forms part of the normal civic obligations of the citizens of a fully self-governing country;

        Minor communal services of a kind which, being performed by the members of the community in the direct interest of the said community, can therefore be considered as normal civic obligations incumbent upon the members of the community, provided that the members of the community or their direct representatives shall have the right to be consulted in regard to the need for such services.

        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forced_labor

        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forced_Labour_Convention

        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Labour_Organization

        Not nice but true none the less.

        gaia

        October 26, 2013 at 9:00 am

      • Gaia, what is “minor” and “communal” about sectioning off a percentage of the population and forcing them into starvation level sub-existence for the rest of their (calculated to be) unnaturally shortened lives?

        habburl

        November 11, 2013 at 2:53 am

  6. Isn’t the “Help to Work” (sic) scheme due to be introduced in April 2014? So how would that affect jobseekers’ signing-on now?

    Or is there some other workfare scheme we don’t know of yet that is due to be introduced soon?

    Samwise Gamgee

    October 25, 2013 at 12:11 pm

    • April 2014 it’s scheduled for. Although I believe ESA claimants are exempt from it at the moment which might explain the new clause in the ATOS appeals process which states that there is no pay while a decision is being appealed.

      Chris

      October 25, 2013 at 12:25 pm

      • Those in the WRAG division of ESA can be mandated to the Work Programme with no end date. So, if you have been found unfit for work, you can be forced to participate from day one of your claim for the rest of your entire life

        The Work Programme provider guidance states that no one on ESA on the WP can be forced to apply for jobs or take part in Mandatory Work Activity, but as usual, the poverty pimps are ignoring the rules/guidance.

        It doesn’t end there…

        The laws states that no one may be coerced to take up medical treatment (because it’s social control) but again, that isn’t stopping the poverty pimps blackmailing those on ESA to take up worthless shite like CBT/medical intervention on pain of the pimp raising a doubt on their claim and them losing their benefit.

        Via Benefits & Work: The DWP have stated (this week) that they will be cheerily breaking the law for those currently on DLA whatever the length of their award.

        If someone makes a malicious or false allegation of fraud against the DLA claimant, the claimant will immediately lose their DLA (all payments will stop) and if, upon investigation, they are found to be innocent, they will then be forced to claim Personal Independence Payment. So for those with indefinite awards, breathing a little sigh of relief that they maybe have until 2015-2017 before they lose DLA, please make sure that you upset absolutely no one at all.

        Fucking furiously
        Lucy

        Lucy

        October 25, 2013 at 2:42 pm

      • Well with the recent utility bill rises and the cost of living rocketing there’s going to be a lot more suicides linked to DWP. Of course they’ll deny any responsibility as usual, but we all now know that suicide is becoming a legitimate way of escaping the torment of falling on hard times. Only those inflicting the pain and suffering are oblivious to what’s going on.

        Chris

        October 25, 2013 at 3:24 pm

  7. I live near Hastings and I signed-on last Monday. I didn’t recieve any letters about changes, but I do have to attend a one-day course called Progress next Wednesday (30/10/13), perhaps I will get something the next-time I sign-on.

    Carl Lawrence

    October 25, 2013 at 12:51 pm

  8. Do our political masters never rest from dreaming up endless demeaning schemes to further humiliate the jobless?

    Here on Tyneside, the latest wheeze is offering them furniture – but only on the proviso that they complete a training course to get them back into work. Presumably, if they refuse (for the quite understandable reason that such schemes rarely result in the attendee finding employment) they can just sit on their arses.

    To add further salt to the wound, the deal amounts to little more than offering those completing the course a negligible amount of cash in return, and an option of taking out a low cost loan (£500) from a local credit union (gee-whizz!).

    The local loan sharks won’t be losing any sleep over this half-baked arrangement.

    Trevor

    October 25, 2013 at 2:08 pm

  9. Chris :
    April 2014 it’s scheduled for. Although I believe ESA claimants are exempt from it at the moment which might explain the new clause in the ATOS appeals process which states that there is no pay while a decision is being appealed.

    There’s no guarantee this is about workfare.

    Frankly with nothing to go on this is speculation which I don’t care for; it spreads fear.

    Could the JC not have provided more information? Can anyone press for it? I have heard nothing about this anywhere else and it strikes me as grossly irresponsible to leave people hanging in this way. Do the PCS know anything about it? When will more info be forthcoming?

    ghost whistler

    October 25, 2013 at 3:56 pm

  10. Trevor :
    Do our political masters never rest from dreaming up endless demeaning schemes to further humiliate the jobless?
    Here on Tyneside, the latest wheeze is offering them furniture – but only on the proviso that they complete a training course to get them back into work. Presumably, if they refuse (for the quite understandable reason that such schemes rarely result in the attendee finding employment) they can just sit on their arses.
    To add further salt to the wound, the deal amounts to little more than offering those completing the course a negligible amount of cash in return, and an option of taking out a low cost loan (£500) from a local credit union (gee-whizz!).
    The local loan sharks won’t be losing any sleep over this half-baked arrangement.

    In Swindon they have the Samaritans working in Jobcentres!

    ghost whistler

    October 25, 2013 at 3:57 pm

  11. Lucy :
    Those in the WRAG division of ESA can be mandated to the Work Programme with no end date. So, if you have been found unfit for work, you can be forced to participate from day one of your claim for the rest of your entire life
    The Work Programme provider guidance states that no one on ESA on the WP can be forced to apply for jobs or take part in Mandatory Work Activity, but as usual, the poverty pimps are ignoring the rules/guidance.
    It doesn’t end there…
    The laws states that no one may be coerced to take up medical treatment (because it’s social control) but again, that isn’t stopping the poverty pimps blackmailing those on ESA to take up worthless shite like CBT/medical intervention on pain of the pimp raising a doubt on their claim and them losing their benefit.
    Via Benefits & Work: The DWP have stated (this week) that they will be cheerily breaking the law for those currently on DLA whatever the length of their award.
    If someone makes a malicious or false allegation of fraud against the DLA claimant, the claimant will immediately lose their DLA (all payments will stop) and if, upon investigation, they are found to be innocent, they will then be forced to claim Personal Independence Payment. So for those with indefinite awards, breathing a little sigh of relief that they maybe have until 2015-2017 before they lose DLA, please make sure that you upset absolutely no one at all.
    Fucking furiously
    Lucy

    This is bizarre! Surely the DWP cannot coerce its staff to break the law, for obvious reasons.

    The WOrk Programme isn’t endless. It’s two years (though given the shit that’s set to follow those that come off it, classed as failures, you might wish it were). They can’t mandate you endlessly.

    I would suggest anyone being blackmailed into medical help to speak to their doctor or the relevant care authorities. There is no way that forcing people to take any kind of intervention is acceptable.

    ghost whistler

    October 25, 2013 at 4:00 pm

    • Yes it’s bizarre, yes it’s unacceptable. But it is true, and is happening.

      From Vox Political (and discussed on several fora at the time) –

      “People on sickness benefits will be required to have regular meetings with doctors, occupational health nurses and therapists to help them address their barriers to work – or face losing their benefits,” the Department for Work and Pensions announced yesterday”

      “yesterday” being around 8th July 2013 if you want to search Mike’s site. It’ll be in the Grauniad somewhere too.

      Even before this, JC Advisors and WP staff have been threatening hapless claimants with sanctions for refusing to engage with so called “health management programmes” which are inevitably run by ill qualified private health providers. I know 3 people around the country who have fallen foul of this. One is terminally ill, ones has severe mental health problems, the other has mental health problems caused by brain injury which are not going to be solved by bolshy fuckwits masquerading as qualified health care providers or bullies lacking any kind of integrity, so long as they get their salary, who cares?

      The nature of illness/injury/disability often means that one isn’t automatically well in the time frame of government funded welfare to work programmes. Those with an ATOS determined length of ESA award of say 3 years will find themselves mandated to the work programme and of course mandatory work activity for the full 3 years. The sick and disabled are being treated like ping pong balls, batted back and forth.

      So if you have a life long illness but you are officially (& incorrectly) determined as being able to work at some time in the future, yes you can be endlessly mandated to the work programme.

      …and if the drugs/treatment don’t exist to help you or do exist and don’t help you, then on the work programme you shall stay, until you die. Because even when sanctioned, you are still officially on the programme.

      Kafka on acid and then some

      Lucy

      Lucy

      October 25, 2013 at 4:43 pm

    • Im afraid I have to say yes, DWP employees can if DWP claim crown immunity.

      As for this medical help, I would have thought your full within your rights to decline as Lucy states but to be honest I would have to know more like what is this medical help, did the advisor offer it or ATOS ?

      I say this as why wasnt the claimant offered this already by their GP long ago prior as part of their treatment. As for the advisor bit, them offering a medical treatment is like a man who sales UPVC glazing offering straight off the bat MEDICAL TREATMENTS, their both not medical practitioners so how would they know what best to prescribe or to put it bluntly, how often do you see a plumber tell a electrician how to do their job.

      gaia

      October 26, 2013 at 9:20 am

      • It won’t be Advisors offering medical treatment, they will be coercing claimants to engage with “health professionals” These “professionals” will likely be from private companies such as ATOS or A4e and won’t be offering anything remotely useful.

        Crown immunity won’t come into it. Already JC+ Advisors are willingly flouting the rules for the benefits they administer, because they know that if they don’t do as they are told they will be sitting on the other side of the desk.

        For the last 20 years there has been a culture of severe rationing in primary care, particularly in the realm of mental health. Many physical conditions aren’t catered for within the NHS funding structure either. Often GPs are not able to refer patients for suitable treatment.

        For mental health, many GPs just hand the patient a photocopy containing a list of local charities and private counsellors. One type is unregulated and potentially harmful, the other out of reach of those surviving on benefits. The latter may not be supervised or audited and can equally cause harm.

        It’s become far too common to blame the patient for not being well in the first place and again when pathetic, half arsed interventions do not help.

        It can only get worse.

        Lucy

        October 26, 2013 at 10:16 am

      • …and if anyone thinks they will be able to sue the powers that be when they have been harmed by these “professionals” – forget it, no legal aid is available for medical negligence and I believe that includes neglect of duty of care too.

        Lucy

        October 26, 2013 at 10:18 am

      • It makes no difference if as you say the advisor is coercing claimants as it would still have to be based on a medical opinion and the last I checked, DWP advisors are not medically trained.

        This said we all know how DWP lie through their teeth and its still entirely possible that they are exploiting a loophole so if you could give an example of such a meeting including verbal comments made by advisor I might be better informed and see the point your making.

        At the end of the day im interested as to whether or not its actually lawful and I cant do that without the facts (case example).

        gaia

        October 26, 2013 at 11:02 am

  12. I signed on yesterday,very aggressive mentality from the clerk “You will soon be finished with the WP,why have still not got a job?” The WP offered nothing and by this I mean Training,Qualifications or Certifications “That is no excuse,if you had really applied yourself I am sure you could of found something” I produced my last 2 Months UJM applications(239) with notes and offered to download applications from other Employment sites “This does not prove that you are fully engaging with the Programme” All right,what do you suggest? “I suggest that you look at the secret job market,their are hidden jobs available” And how do I go about this? ‘?????” I mean if they are secret or hidden how do I find them? “When you are finished with the WP,you will either attend daily,do community work or accept a training course” Great what Training is available? “You do not get to pick which of the 3” Really? According to the DWP guidelines,it states “The Claimant will have to pick 1 of 3 options” would you like to see the DWP guidelines? “That is not what it means” I disagree,but what Training is available? “We are still rolling out the programme at this time” So no Training is available? How about Placements? “You will have to sign on daily while we evaluate your situation” Oh,and what will I do Daily? “Sign on!” Will their be classes? Job search? Tests? could you please give me an outline? “When you are finished with the WP we will inform you” Of what? ……”.Sign your book,do not argue with us”……Another ill thought out plan,they really do not have a Bloody clue!

    ou812

    October 25, 2013 at 4:02 pm

    • Dear Jobseeker,
      Please follow the conditions outlined below or lose all benefits forever.
      -Be a white heterosexual single ablebodied Christian British male. Otherwise you are deliberately making yourself unemployable.
      -Go back in a time machine to 35 years before you were born and create complete CVs for your whole life, for all dates before and after the current date of 2013.
      -Pogo-stick to the moon and back, and bring back a lump of moon rock.
      -Create a shrine in your bedroom to the goddesses Ann Widdecombe and Esther McVey. Pray to it daily. We will be checking, via the 24 hour camera and microphone we have installed in your home.
      -Give up sleep and rest because you must use every second to search for jobs. Give up going to the toilet. Search for jobs while cooking and eating and dressing, and while travelling to and from the work programme, jobcentre, workfare, etc.
      -Adore IDS; but not in any kind of gay way, or you will be executed for treason.
      -Sell us your organs, blood, body parts etc. (actually we will take them and not pay you).
      -Please leave your soul at the door. Together with your self respect, self confidence, and self esteem. Abandon hope all ye who enter here.
      -Don’t go to church unless you are actively jobseeking all the time while you are there.
      -Don’t have a television or read a paper, as it is a frivolous waste of your benefits; but somehow stay up to date with current affairs.
      -Don’t pay your rent or buy food, as it is a frivolous waste of your benefits.
      -Simultaneously have no internet because it is a luxury, and have the internet because it is mandatory for jobsearch.
      -Simultaneously be alive and dead, and employed and unemployed, to help our statistics look good.
      -‘Volunteer’ for the EDL for extra credit. If they ever throw you out, you can use the experience to be hired as a G4S security guard at your Jobcentre.
      -Nail a jelly to the wall.
      -Make a drink in a chocolate teapot.
      -Teach a fish to ride a bicycle.
      -Apply for 100 jobs a day.
      -Love Big Brother (we don’t mean the show).
      -Fail to look depressed when we ridicule you for being covered in your own urine and faeces because we banned you from going to the toilet. This state of course does nothing whatsoever to reduce your employability quotient. Your lack of a job is entirely your own fault and nothing to do with the economy, capitalism, technology, or the government.
      -If you are not already a capitalist conservative, convert to being one immediately.
      -If you have any pets, kill them in front of us. Once they are gone, you can give us more of your time and attention for the vital and glorious business of jobseeking. The lack of jobs in this context is utterly irrelevant.
      -If you are the carer for any elderly, young, or disabled people, please deliver them to our friendly neighbourhood lorries with the big canisters of carbon monoxide attached. This will free up your time to do even more lovely jobseeking.
      -Once you are working 24 hours a day 7 days a week on jobseeking activity, work programme, and workfare, please continue nonstop until further notice. The government are currently working on a new scheme, to expand a day to 80 hours and a week to 9 days. The plan is to create extra time for jobseekers to do jobsearch and workfare.
      -Abandon eyelids. Blinking now counts as deliberate shirking of work reponsibilities.
      -If selected for workfare that is located underwater, develop gills.
      -Workfare schemes will be shortly commencing in selected areas, that involve workfare units (formerly referred to as jobseekers) being fed radioactive waste until they either become nonviable, or until they get better.
      -Fill in this form 50 times a week.

      Your cooperation is expected.
      -Yours sincerely,
      The Department of Welfare Porn

      something survived...

      October 25, 2013 at 5:38 pm

  13. Trevor :

    Do our political masters never rest from dreaming up endless demeaning schemes to further humiliate the jobless?

    Obviously not.

    I live in a place which is, to say, the least, is full of problems of poverty.

    Every day some person or other asks me for money in the street.

    Only last night after the Suffolk People’s Assembly Meeting a group of us were approached by someone begging in St Helen’s Street.

    Is this kind of gobshite the solution?

    Andrew Coates

    October 25, 2013 at 4:02 pm

  14. I’d say WANKERS!!!! but, wanking is a productive and meaningful activity

    something survived...

    October 25, 2013 at 4:50 pm

    • …and it proves that you have use of your hands and are fit for work

      Lucy

      October 25, 2013 at 5:00 pm

      • Well actually you don’t necessarily need hands, I know people without arms who say they’ve worked out how to use their feet. Or you can rub against stuff or sit on something that vibrates. Oops shouldn’t have said this. My friend who is disabled says that the quote from that Tory bitch (I don’t recall which one) that disabled limbless or paralysed people should be forced to work because ‘they can lick a stamp’, is hilarious. She then does the mime of a person trying to bend down to the table to lick a stamp. Let’s say it isn’t easy.

        something survived...

        October 25, 2013 at 5:51 pm

      • Witty return Lucy, I wouldn’t be at all surprized if DWP would state such a thing.

        gaia

        October 26, 2013 at 11:05 am

    • Very good joke. I am pleased you still have a sense of humour.

      spidersweb42

      November 4, 2013 at 11:06 am

    • If thats the case what about Police Officer And Police Inspecktor

      www.

      November 4, 2013 at 11:27 am

  15. Lucy :
    Here we are:-
    http://mikesivier.wordpress.com/2013/07/09/doubletalking-dwps-new-assault-on-the-sick/
    .

    Then it’s down to doctors whose time will be taken up with these extra appointments that need to get with the programme here.

    ghost whistler

    October 25, 2013 at 5:24 pm

    • Don’t kid yourself that it will be doctors delivering this. It is more likely to be struck off nurses, hcas, occupational therapists and physiotherapists given a bit of extra training or anyone who can put together a successful tender.

      It’s also likely that the many charities offering counselling by unqualified, inexperienced volunteers will also be in on the act, because any provider is going to get paid.

      Already, those delivering CBT for Positive Step only have to have a “related” qualification and 3 years experience. They then get six weeks training and off they go, delivering bullshit, reductive fake therapy to very vulnerable and mentally ill people.

      I imagine that work programme staff will also be offered the opportunity to do 40hrs health awareness training and be allowed to deliver “health management programmes”

      This kind of thing happened in the 90s. Those working in the welfare to work industry were constantly telling the then Training Agency that their vulnerable clients needed more support than just cod vocational training. The Training Agency funded 40hr “Introduction to Counselling Skills” courses and voila! Suddenly every pimp provider could offer counselling and cause no end of damage to individuals.

      It’s all happened before, it is happening again, but the ability to sanction and the black box approach have made it lethal

      Lucy

      October 25, 2013 at 5:33 pm

      • And nothing to stop a dodgy unqualified person you know already, from getting the job as your assessor, and asking for your medical details! This includes pervs, blackmailers, evil neighbours, stalkers, rapists….

        something survived...

        October 25, 2013 at 5:54 pm

      • I cant say I have heard of health awareness training but I have heard of mental health awareness train and health and safety training but H&S IS NOTHING TO DO WITH HEALTH ISSUES and MHAT only covers one topic of health so advisors would have to sit untold courses to cover all ills and that’s going to cost a pretty penny. Worthy of note is that these courses only take 2 hours each. what on earth can you teach in 2 hours, nothing that’s what so these courses actually work in the claimants favour if they know how to present the evidence.

        Interesting posts Lucy with possible answer to thwart DWP and providers plans maybe.

        gaia

        October 26, 2013 at 11:15 am

      • Too right Lucy.

        As someone with, to put it mildly, a bit of an academic background, and whose sister is a full-time academic in the nursing field, I cannae thole this utter cod cack.

        Andrew Coates

        October 28, 2013 at 4:36 pm

    • It amazes me that the tories talk of cutting the welfare bill yet seem to be spending a awful lot of money ontop of the benefits they pay out to claimants.

      Like I have maintained throughout, the taxpayer spends more on peters and pauls than actual handouts in terms of benefit.

      gaia

      October 26, 2013 at 9:53 am

  16. The new signing book now states weekly/fortnightly signing times and i have to sign weekly but looks to be without any reason when i attended just to waste time.

    the job centre will send people on anything,five days of stress management are supposed to solve a lifetime condition on a whim of a jobseekers direction.

    work is the answer to everything even tough they have taken it on themselves to push everyone on to poverty wages. nothing is mentioned about the problems faced by the disabled trying to find work,the problems that often occur when in employment.

    the shaw trusts advice was to”shut up about it” when dealing with depression as if no one would notice. complete denial will not reduce reliance on benefits.

    ken

    October 25, 2013 at 5:25 pm

    • And if you develop a stress condition from being sent on the anti-stress course????

      something survived...

      October 25, 2013 at 5:55 pm

      • It will, in line with the current primary and secondary care ethos as practiced amongst the money grabbing charlatans of the welfare to work business – be “your own fault”

        Lucy

        October 26, 2013 at 10:20 am

  17. ou812 :
    I signed on yesterday,very aggressive mentality from the clerk “You will soon be finished with the WP,why have still not got a job?” The WP offered nothing and by this I mean Training,Qualifications or Certifications “That is no excuse,if you had really applied yourself I am sure you could of found something” I produced my last 2 Months UJM applications(239) with notes and offered to download applications from other Employment sites “This does not prove that you are fully engaging with the Programme” All right,what do you suggest? “I suggest that you look at the secret job market,their are hidden jobs available” And how do I go about this? ‘?????” I mean if they are secret or hidden how do I find them? “When you are finished with the WP,you will either attend daily,do community work or accept a training course” Great what Training is available? “You do not get to pick which of the 3″ Really? According to the DWP guidelines,it states “The Claimant will have to pick 1 of 3 options” would you like to see the DWP guidelines? “That is not what it means” I disagree,but what Training is available? “We are still rolling out the programme at this time” So no Training is available? How about Placements? “You will have to sign on daily while we evaluate your situation” Oh,and what will I do Daily? “Sign on!” Will their be classes? Job search? Tests? could you please give me an outline? “When you are finished with the WP we will inform you” Of what? ……”.Sign your book,do not argue with us”……Another ill thought out plan,they really do not have a Bloody clue!

    I cannot see how they can facilitate daily signing. Any JC manager that thinks it’s workable needs their head testing. It will cost a bloody fortune travelling daily and for what? This is a recipe for violence. People will be kept in a perpetual state of frustration, forced to queue fo hours to be seen. What a fucking joke.

    ghost whistler

    October 25, 2013 at 5:27 pm

    • The job centres’ sole purpose is to instill a complete sense of worthlessness into anybody who walks into one. I’m on ESA myself, it’s the worst experience ever. Demoralising, miserable and designed to be as unpleasant as possible.

      Last week someone through a chair through the main window at our local jobcentre from the inside. They’ve had numerous bomb hoaxes in the last few years. Sooner or later someone suicidal is going to go in with nothing to lose and wipe out themselves and half of the staff who work there.

      Chris

      October 25, 2013 at 8:51 pm

    • Maybe but their all have a perfect excuse of why they cant jobsearch 35 hours a week.

      gaia

      October 26, 2013 at 9:57 am

  18. ken :
    The new signing book now states weekly/fortnightly signing times and i have to sign weekly but looks to be without any reason when i attended just to waste time.
    the job centre will send people on anything,five days of stress management are supposed to solve a lifetime condition on a whim of a jobseekers direction.
    work is the answer to everything even tough they have taken it on themselves to push everyone on to poverty wages. nothing is mentioned about the problems faced by the disabled trying to find work,the problems that often occur when in employment.
    the shaw trusts advice was to”shut up about it” when dealing with depression as if no one would notice. complete denial will not reduce reliance on benefits.

    The Shaw Trust are another bunch of scumbags who seem to have earned a positive reputation. Just like my chums, the Sally Army.

    ghost whistler

    October 25, 2013 at 5:28 pm

  19. im back to weekly signing as well just had 2 weeks of going every other day to try and get me to sign off jsa and was told ill have to go every day soon but it wont happen as the bus fair is to high and got paid a fuel allowance of 2 quid there and back and that is not even half the bus fair there and back.

    also it was paid in to my account so had to wait 3 working days to even get it back so going every day is not going to happen and will just be put on another useless course again in the new year to hide me again.

    super ted

    October 25, 2013 at 5:36 pm

  20. Shit today’s depressing. Here’s a thought to cheer people up.

    Dead Tories

    something survived...

    October 25, 2013 at 5:58 pm

    • 😀

      …with side orders of fries and baked beans and a medium-sized coke.

      JBS

      October 25, 2013 at 6:09 pm

  21. i had my hit squad adviser done 3 times by the floor manager showed him i had no cash in my bank and he then wanted me to go in the next day and was told to walk 10 miles to sign on the twat, then said ill have to go every day till i said how much the bus fair is going to be half my benefits so that went in the bin then was told to go on a course run buy learn direct but said i have put in a complaint against them and will not be going on anything run by them as i still have no exit report from the wp run by them and was parked for the hole 2 years.

    they now have nothing left to throw at me till the new year and then its just a course run by the local collage 😉

    super ted

    October 25, 2013 at 6:09 pm

    • Not to mention at a walking pace of 3.6 MPH it would mean you would walk for nearly 3 hours and that’s not even seen as realistic even for the working to do in order to get to work (90 min rule) meaning at 3.6 MPH that would make the expected fair mileage to be of around 5 and half miles.

      Good on you Super ted.

      gaia

      October 26, 2013 at 10:06 am

  22. “Work Choice provider in government probe over job outcome ‘scam’”:

    http://disabilitynewsservice.com/2013/10/work-choice-provider-in-government-probe-over-job-outcome-scam/

    JBS

    October 25, 2013 at 9:19 pm

    • That’s the thing I love about greed, it always exposes a scam practiced by business.

      For the record businesses create more scams/cons than criminals, yet are still treated under civil law.

      gaia

      October 26, 2013 at 10:15 am

  23. A DWP spokeswoman said: “We take any [allegations of such behaviour] by contractors very seriously.

    my jcp floor manager dont give a shit about me being parked for the hole 2 years and just said wp for me is finished and left it at that n said i have to complane about it as they not interested in fraud committed by 3rd partys.

    super ted

    October 25, 2013 at 9:38 pm

  24. If you have a compliant don’t take it to the JCP managers or JCP area managers, they just sweep it under the carpet as they don’t want their advisers to be portrayed as doing something wrong or illegal.

    We all know that most of these advisers are risking court action by blindly following instructions from their bent managers and the bent managers are only concerned with their respective JCP advisers hitting sanction targets and MWA referral targets under threat of being sacked if they don’t.

    All of this comes down from the DWP Caxton House in London under direction from IDS, sooner or later it will be time to pay the piper and the nuremburg excuse will not save them from prision time.

    Obi Wan Kenobi

    October 26, 2013 at 9:13 am

    • There is no one to complain to. I raised a complaint months ago for bullying and fraud on JCP/WP part. The problem is that they are so slow that nothing happens (I doubt they investigate anything) and until the DWP give their final response the Independent case examiner or ombudsman won’t even lift a finger to help.

      In the meantime bullying is rife, sanctions for not attending appointments I don’t know about and pressure to apply for jobs that I can’t physically do for health reasons.

      If I had a gun I’d stand in front of my advisor, put it in my mouth and pull the trigger. Seems to be the only way forward.

      Chris

      October 26, 2013 at 9:37 am

    • As much as I would love for IDS to be shown the slammer, we both know its never going to happen as why wasn’t both Bush and Blair locked up for crimes against humanity, fraud and murder to name but a few crimes their guilty of?

      Nice thought though Obi Wan.

      gaia

      October 26, 2013 at 10:28 am

      • Remember those nice guys Saddam Hussein and Omar Gaddafi?

        They had the protection of “great powers” once upon a time but they were got rid of like so much offal when no longer of any use. It does`nt take much to imagine this country being demoted to tin pot client status by the up and coming BRICS alliance, does it?

        michtich

        October 28, 2013 at 9:14 am

      • Many a country has had their day to rule the planet and Englands empire ended as some strongly suggest after WW2. Its nature fullstop to attain alpha male status so it stands to reason that todays is China and Russia. Lets hope they don’t screw it up like Europe and the god awful USA.

        The US is so desperate to regain the global crown, they have hidden a national debt that can never be repaid while destroying their water aquifers countrywide.

        gaia

        October 29, 2013 at 9:46 am

  25. Work for Your Dole: Jolly good idea! And about bloody time too!

    Old Tory

    October 26, 2013 at 10:23 am

    • Your right, it is a good idea or should I say COULD have been, sadly like Labour the Tories will just short sight it like their other policies and turn it into pure crap OR as I consistently demonstrate the tory work for benefit is a CARBON COPY of MWA under the labour government as was the work programme to Labours FND programme.

      Lastly to correct you its not strictly as you say work for your dole as it would imply an employee contract meaning employment rules, meaning MINIMUM WAGE, This my friend is not the case now is it.

      I suppose you probably wouldn’t know this what with being old tory but things have changed, we have employment regulations these days.

      gaia

      October 26, 2013 at 10:41 am

    • If there’s work to be done, why not pay a living wage to do it instead? Why not create jobs?

      JBS

      October 26, 2013 at 3:08 pm

      • Your absolutely right JBS, especially when you consider fairness as the tories LOVE TO TOUT.

        To work is not training, nor an experience so technically if we are to work for our benefit then we should have it reflected pound for pound in relation to benefit Vs min wage.

        The system as im sure your aware doesn’t work as if you don’t have internet and a PC at home yet work 35 hours a week in the day, how on earth are you going to be able to search for work if your reliant on libraries and the likes.

        As for the min wage argument I don’t see the problem now they have grouped the benefits together as its hardly fair someone claiming just JSA/ESA should do the same hours as a claimant drawing JSA/ESA ontop of housing benefit and council tax relief and possibly a few more.

        Think about it, if your total benefit draw for the year is this 350 a week limit it would mean for this 35 hour a week work for your benefit you would be paid £10 an hour (that’s £3.69 a hour more than national min), yet if you were only drawing say JSA then you would be on a poultry £2.02 a hour for a 35 hour week.

        Im surprized no one has brought this chestnut up as its a valid argument, WHY SHOULD SOMEONE CLAIMING FAR LESS BENEFITS BE EXPECTED TO WORK AS MUCH AS A MULTIPLE BENEFIT DRAWER BUT FOR LESS PER HOUR?

        gaia

        October 28, 2013 at 8:23 am

  26. something survived… :
    And nothing to stop a dodgy unqualified person you know already, from getting the job as your assessor, and asking for your medical details! This includes pervs, blackmailers, evil neighbours, stalkers, rapists….

    Serco have or are being investigated for not running Enhanced CRB checks on their employees who run the work programme, so your fears could be very well founded.

    Lucy

    October 26, 2013 at 10:24 am

    • Hate to burst the bubble but technically as long as your in constant view of a CRB cleared employee actually you can work with this group unless the law has changed recently.

      gaia

      October 26, 2013 at 10:43 am

      • Sorry, theirs obviously a bit more to it than view but you get my gist. Should have said overviewed.

        gaia

        October 26, 2013 at 10:44 am

      • You are not bursting my bubble Gaia. Enhanced CRB checks are required for ALL employees working with vulnerable individuals or groups.

        Lucy

        October 26, 2013 at 2:06 pm

      • The rules around CRBs are a joke Lucy, the what constitutes as is full of exploits both for and against the very idea. The biggest joke is its only good against the convicted yet does zero to stop the unknown who it appears are in larger numbers.
        You name it, policemen, religious figures, judges, ministers, Tv stars, careworkers, the list is endless so as you can see if theirs an argument to be had with CRBs, its that actually they don’t work as a whole.

        gaia

        October 27, 2013 at 5:33 am

  27. It would appear that workfare is now unstoppable. I will do the 6 month placement. However, I will be the placement from hell; and furthermore, it will happen in circumstances in which I will never be sanctioned or censured by the Jobcentre and the pimp. Oh they’ll know it’s me causing all the chaos and damage, but there won’t be a damn thing they’ll be able to do about it. Who ever I am placed with, I will make sure that company rues the day they ever heard of workfare and the pimp.

    Them's Fighting Words

    October 26, 2013 at 10:59 am

    • That’s what DWP invented the 35 hour search for at their offices along with daily signing.

      You do realise you just admitted to sabotage and that it is a crime to plot and conspire(preemptive law).

      gaia

      October 26, 2013 at 11:23 am

      • My dear gaia, I will not be committing any acts of criminal damage and nor will I be encouraging/inciting others to do so, either. I am just going to be a pain in the you-know-what; that’s all. For example: did you know that if refuse to sign any of the pimp’s paperwork it doesn’t effect your benefits? You’d be surprised how many people on the WP, including myself, knew that. That’s just one example of sticking it up them! I’ve just left the WP and ny provider, Seetec, phoned me up to see how I was doing and they wanted me to know that they are still there for me. Are they bollocks there for me. They just want to claim that juicy wedge when/if I find a sustainable job.

        Them's Fighting Words

        October 26, 2013 at 12:19 pm

      • Them's Fighting Words

        October 26, 2013 at 12:23 pm

      • Nothing wrong with not signing a contract as after all it is suppose to be negotiable yet never is.

        gaia

        October 27, 2013 at 5:44 am

    • “Jobcentre and the pimp.” I prefer the word “ponce”.

      Nastier.

      Andrew Coates

      October 26, 2013 at 2:11 pm

  28. For anyone coming up to their old age pension and thinking “thank God I am”, think again.

    http://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2013/10/26/irel-o26.html

    They want it ALL.

    http://theautomaticearth.com/Finance/the-imf-proposes-a-10-supertax-on-all-eurozone-household-savings.html

    Annos

    October 26, 2013 at 1:13 pm

    • Not old but an interesting read none the less, thanks Annos

      gaia

      October 27, 2013 at 5:47 am

  29. Not been informed of any alterations or meetings yet in Bradford, apart from the fact that I am to begin MWA on Monday am, 9 – 5, 5 days a week, for 4 weeks, OR I get my JSA sanctioned for 3 Months. Fuck.

    Landless Peasant

    October 26, 2013 at 10:58 pm

    • Landless Peasant:

      Did you know that if you have any medical issues such as a bad back for example, you can get your MWA cut down to 16 hours a week, to do this you need to see your JCP adviser.

      I did this when they put me on my MWA as I do have a history of back problems listed on my JCP file, they reduced my hours because I threatened to get my doctor invovled if they refused.

      Obi Wan Kenobi

      October 27, 2013 at 9:31 am

      • Do you have any FOIs or such like to justify that?

        Lucozade

        October 31, 2013 at 9:51 am

    • Landless Peasant:

      9 – 5, 5 days a week allowing 1 hour daily for lunch = 35 hours

      You do know that the absolute maximum you can do on an MWA is 30 hours a week only,
      you need to go see your JCP adviser and get that sorted out – Quicksmart!

      Obi Wan Kenobi

      October 28, 2013 at 6:57 pm

  30. gaia :
    The rules around CRBs are a joke Lucy, the what constitutes as is full of exploits both for and against the very idea. The biggest joke is its only good against the convicted yet does zero to stop the unknown who it appears are in larger numbers.
    You name it, policemen, religious figures, judges, ministers, Tv stars, careworkers, the list is endless so as you can see if theirs an argument to be had with CRBs, its that actually they don’t work as a whole.

    None the less, an enhanced CRB check will highlight all cautions, warnings, not just convictions and anyone working with vulnerable indivduals is required to have one by law.

    Supervised or not, they must have an enhanced CRB check completed and assessed before they take up a post working with individuals.

    Seetec are likely to be frantically applying for these now they have been found out.

    Lucy

    October 27, 2013 at 12:13 pm

    • Oops, I meant Serco, not Seetec. ^

      Lucy

      October 27, 2013 at 12:14 pm

    • Like I said Lucy, most of these advisors wont have criminal records and even if they did unless your on the risk register it is down to the sole discretion of the employer to decide whether or not to hire this person irrespective of spent or unspent criminal convictions.

      Law only states you must apply, it has next to no power to stop an employer hiring someone who is not on the mentioned register.

      Safeguarding Vulnerable Groups Act 2006

      3Barred persons

      (1)A reference to a person being barred from regulated activity must be construed in accordance with this section.

      (2)A person is barred from regulated activity relating to children if he is—
      (a)included in the children’s barred list;
      (b)included in a list maintained under the law of Scotland or Northern Ireland which the Secretary of State specifies by order as corresponding to the children’s barred list.

      (3)A person is barred from regulated activity relating to vulnerable adults if he is—
      (a)included in the adults’ barred list;
      (b)included in a list maintained under the law of Scotland or Northern Ireland which the Secretary of State specifies by order as corresponding to the adults’ barred list.

      gaia

      October 28, 2013 at 8:59 am

  31. gaia :
    I cant say I have heard of health awareness training but I have heard of mental health awareness train and health and safety training but H&S IS NOTHING TO DO WITH HEALTH ISSUES and MHAT only covers one topic of health so advisors would have to sit untold courses to cover all ills and that’s going to cost a pretty penny. Worthy of note is that these courses only take 2 hours each. what on earth can you teach in 2 hours, nothing that’s what so these courses actually work in the claimants favour if they know how to present the evidence.
    Interesting posts Lucy with possible answer to thwart DWP and providers plans maybe.

    There won’t be any thwarting of the DWP Gaia, much as I would like to see it. The people who fall prey to these Advisors coercing them onto such programmes aren’t going to be in the luxury position of funding legal challenges or surviving without their benefits.

    Despite your post with links to commercial injury lawyers, there won’t be any legal aid available to those who are caused harm by these programmes. That is the law as it stands now (courtesy of Ken Clarke). The harms caused won’t be considered severe or due to medical negligence because these ridiculous programmes are not run under the rules of medical practice.

    Medical opinion won’t come into it. Just as medical opinion doesn’t come into the decisions of DMs nudged by ATOS to find people with terminal illnesses or profound disability, fit for work or work related activity.

    Lucy

    October 27, 2013 at 12:20 pm

    • Would We Have Any Chance Under The European Court Of Human Rights Or The United Nations Charter On Civil And Human Rights To Challenge ATOS DWP Etc. What Does The International Labour Organisation Say O This Matter

      philip brown

      October 27, 2013 at 1:54 pm

      • The EU is not a fan of it so we will have to see how it turns out legally if challenged.

        gaia

        October 28, 2013 at 9:02 am

    • Im sorry but that’s just flatout wrong and the very fact people have appealed and had it turned over proves that point. IF YOUR ASSESSING IF SOMEONE IS FIT FOR WORK YOU ARE REFERING TO THEIR STATE OF HEALTH AND AS SUCH REQUIRES MEDICAL KNOWLEDGE. Sure the government through ATOS tried to do it in unregulated fashion but was found wanting and are still under pressure now about it.

      They know at the end of the day its all on an individual basis and what with most claimants being clueless as to the law preyed on it. This doesn’t imply their actions were correct, nor just but this is how we all know DWP behave unless of course their claiming this crown immunity people have mentioned on this very site lately as then I would look at any legal action to be very protracted if taken out against them as although it doesn’t make them bullet proof, does call for a greater tact of law which like I said, most don’t know.

      gaia

      October 28, 2013 at 9:15 am

      • Gaia, everyone affected knows that it is wrong. This is why people are so angry and despairing and have been since 2008, when this monstrously cruel regime was put in place.

        The government do not listen, they refuse to listen. They change the law on whim when it looks like they may be forced to listen.

        The rules have changed. Rules no longer exists. Guidelines now form the basis for administration in everything from healthcare to benefits.

        This government have removed the right to assessment by qualified and competent doctors

        They have taken away the right to immediate appeal before a First Tier Tribunal

        They have taken away the right to receive benefits during the compulsory reconsideration stage

        They have taken away the right to Legal Aid for all matters pertaining to benefits.

        We are soon going to lose the right to Judicial Review

        They look the other way when JC+ and WP staff deliberately ignore the rules for administration of benefits and programmes.

        No matter the level of your ire, the government do not care. The media do not care.

        Lucy

        October 28, 2013 at 11:17 am

  32. What About British Civil Law

    philip brown

    October 27, 2013 at 1:59 pm

  33. Lucy :
    It will, in line with the current primary and secondary care ethos as practiced amongst the money grabbing charlatans of the welfare to work business – be “your own fault”

    I nominate this as IUA Comment of the Year.

    JBS

    October 27, 2013 at 4:25 pm

  34. Heard a rumor today that anybody that can’t get to placements or providers because of the storm, they MAY have a sanction doubt as some have computer generated registers. They may escape if they travel by the previously advertised ‘disrupted transport’ routes.

    Mr Middlesex

    October 28, 2013 at 8:49 am

  35. Please sign this e-petition.

    We call for a Cumulative Impact Assessment of Welfare Reform, and a New Deal for sick & disabled people based on their needs, abilities and ambitions.

    Responsible department: Department for Work and Pensions.

    http://epetitions.direct.gov.uk/petitions/43154

    Obi Wan Kenobi

    October 28, 2013 at 10:55 am

  36. Iain Duncan Smith’s disability reforms delayed as system buckles under pressure.

    See more at: http://www.cityam.com/blog/1382706673/iain-duncan-smiths-disability-reforms-delayed-system-buckles#sthash.FpMP3JB9.dpuf

    Obi Wan Kenobi

    October 28, 2013 at 11:03 am

    • BBC news website is proud to announce the rolling out of Universal Credit scheme this morning in a pilot scheme in Hammersmith and Fulham. Will be interesting to see the results seeing as the DWP IT systems are about as stable as a one legged man doing the Hokey Cokey.

      Chris

      October 28, 2013 at 2:10 pm

      • From that BBC report:

        “…the case for benefit reform may be weakened if there are no jobs for people to move into, or it is not possible for them to work extra hours.”

        Finally, the penny fucking drops.

        http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-24694137

        JBS

        October 28, 2013 at 4:00 pm

      • The penny might drop but Cameron and co will still blame the economic recession on the unemployed and disabled.

        Chris

        October 28, 2013 at 4:49 pm

      • Well, Chris, if Johnny Void is right, we should be able to report Cameron and co to the police as suspected terrorists 😀

        JBS

        October 28, 2013 at 5:50 pm

      • Whoops, I used the word “terrorists”.

        Big hello to all the bods at GCHQ, from – well, you know where 😉

        JBS

        October 28, 2013 at 6:23 pm

  37. What next Goosey Loosey, is the sky going to fall in. Stop the fear mongering and try not to incite any unreasonable fear in people.
    I only asked if there was any truth to it. Why did you phrase it in the past tense, like it had already happened. You are the one that needs educating in the facts and not your possible myths.

    ed

    October 28, 2013 at 5:38 pm

    • ed, why are you replying to a comment on a thread from The Void, on here?

      It looks as if you not only need some support around your comprehension skills and your ability to recognise past and future tense in written form, but you could do with some help with surfing the net too.

      Actually ed, following posters around on the net, makes you look like a creepy little stalker, not just a troll.

      Have a lovely evening.

      Lucy

      October 28, 2013 at 5:58 pm

  38. well i was not allowed to sign on as they said they could smell alcohol on my breath and was told to ring the jcp and make another appointment to sign on and told to leave the jcp office. buy g4s guard, also was not allowed to use the phones so had to ring the premium number to get another appointment to sign on.

    now the only thing i had to drink was mouth wash as my teeth r n bad shape and have to use mouth wash 4 times a day and yep it has alcohol in it so wtf am i meant to do other than not use any at all the days i have to go to the jcp or get accused of being a piss head when i have had nothing to drink apart from mouth wash.

    also cant drink even if i wanted 2 as the meds im on will just make me ill anyway and i have a sick note as well for the above but was not interested and told to leave the jcp and make another appointment when im not pissed on mouth wash.lol or smell of alcohol.

    super ted

    October 28, 2013 at 6:58 pm

  39. What next from G4S, JCP+ goons? escorting you into a back room and attacing electrodes to your testicals, if they think you’ve had a couple of pints. Bastards!

    Essence of Scouse

    October 29, 2013 at 4:42 am

  40. I and others said “that government cant make work pay so their make sure not working doesn’t”, WELL FINALLY CAMERON STATES THAT VERY THINGS

    Cameron “Second, let’s reform the welfare system so it does not pay to be out of work and it pays you to be in work. And thirdly, let’s have the sensible controls on immigration.”

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-24706858

    gaia

    October 29, 2013 at 7:27 am

  41. Keep homes safely warmed, government urges

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-24673018

    More proof of the governments delusion or is that collusion with energy companies despite prices rising way beyond what most working can afford, let alone the unemployed and poor.

    gaia

    October 29, 2013 at 9:09 am

  42. Hope this helps some.

    The Warm Home Discount Scheme. I claimed it at the end of last year. so will probably have to wait till next year for my new claim. Well worth it.

    https://www.gov.uk/the-warm-home-discount-scheme/overview

    ED

    October 29, 2013 at 9:27 am

    • Yes. I was informed by Southern Electric last year that I will be entitled to claim this year. I am waiting for them to contact me. It comes in handy as current heating is through Economy 7 Storage Heaters. These can be expensive to run. I Agree there is NO harm in asking or even applying for it.

      Philip

      October 29, 2013 at 9:39 am

    • No offence ED but you forgot to state eligibility for the scheme as unless you are 75 or over and getting the Guarantee Credit element of Pension Credit (even if you get Savings Credit) or under 75 and only getting the Guarantee Credit element of Pension Credit (you won’t qualify if you also get Savings Credit), you don’t qualify.

      https://www.gov.uk/the-warm-home-discount-scheme/eligibility

      With a population figure of those around 65 years of age and over being around 10 million means this scheme only helps just over 15% of the total population.

      This aside what does the money represent when the applier in all likely hood is completely unaware of their current wattage use. You see people make the mistake of assuming whats written on the appliance is KWh when infact its just KW or more correctly put the required wattage per second inorder for said appliance to function.

      Now what you don’t know is boilers are designed to work effectively at exterior temperatures not exceeding -1 degrees which at the time was considered the norm. Now this hasn’t changed despite the climate doing so year on year meaning with every extra degree below the boiler has to work twice as hard with no guarantee to reach your desired temp before the boilers internal stat kicks in (prevents damage to boiler) and that’s if it does (ie, water cant gain heat fast enough dew to external influences like outside temp). Equated into real terms it means your boilers are on longer thus offsetting this 135 pound a year.

      Lagging and drylining amongst other insulators don’t stop heat escaping, they de-accelerate it as if they did stop heat your property would be just one wet mold patch (humity in air turning back into water). Im not saying its a complete con nor a bad idea, what im saying is at best it saves you from energy price rises for only one year as after that no matter how many times you do it, it offers zero savings fullstop.

      The energy companies and their puppets the government never told you this did they, never told you that they never want you to be able to effectively trap energy their by reducing profits for the big six as heat regardless of being the desired product (heater) or side effect (heat coming off a pump in motion) is the biggest user of energy on the planet, especially when you consider heat is an impedance to electricity which has the effect of increasing resistance of the circuit their by making the appliance less effective at being cost effective to use. This basically means the appliance is less effective at running thus requiring you to run it longer.

      Now no doubt it will be argued if temps are falling in the UK then surely the appliances become more cost effective, NO as although it would reduce heat, the cold actually lowers resistance within the circuit meaning more current flowing through the parts thus effectively lowering their life expectancy.

      Just like DWP, the energy companies and government are misleading you by playing on your ignorance yet again so as helpful as a few quid might appear it doesn’t actually address the problem overall, especially if only 15% of the population are getting it.

      gaia

      October 29, 2013 at 11:22 am

      • No offence taken gaia.

        I did start with “Hope this helps SOME.

        I just did not want to get into a long ramble about eligibility.

        Thanks for the info.

        ED

        October 29, 2013 at 11:54 am

  43. OH YES. Energy bosses are to be grilled by Parliament later today…….Who’s paying for the Gas LOL ;0)

    Philip

    October 29, 2013 at 9:41 am

    • They wont need to the entire thing will be powered by hot air

      growls

      October 29, 2013 at 9:49 am

  44. So Maybe The Can Capture It. Who Was It Once Said Save Gas Fart In A Jar

    Philip

    October 29, 2013 at 9:55 am

  45. OT.

    “A third employee at the Serco-operated centre was also dismissed for failing to take any action when the female detainee reported the two men.”

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-beds-bucks-herts-24719300

    Annos

    October 29, 2013 at 9:56 am

  46. \

    Philip

    October 29, 2013 at 9:56 am

  47. Lumpenprole :
    Don’t the Disability Employment Advisers work for the DWP? How can they be trusted?

    Depends on who you get I suppose. But it might be worth getting the reasons for using the alcohol mouthwash on Ted’s record and having it recorded that he can’t drink due to meds, so thug advisors can no longer claim he’s been drinking and mess up his signing.

    Lucy

    October 29, 2013 at 12:13 pm

    • BTW, anyone who receives any benefit is entitled to see the DEA.

      Lucy

      October 29, 2013 at 12:14 pm

  48. New e-petition, please sign, – over 2,800 signitures in less than 24 hours.

    Benefit Sanctions Must Be Stopped Without Exceptions in UK.

    http://you.38degrees.org.uk/petitions/benefit-sanctions-must-be-stopped-without-exceptions-in-uk

    Obi Wan Kenobi

    October 29, 2013 at 3:34 pm

  49. they will not allow access to a dea advisor post work programme while under the hit squad,always ask to see one if there’s a problem,by not doing so they are undermining their position in case of appeals.

    ken

    October 29, 2013 at 3:43 pm

    • Surely refusing access to a DEA is discrimination? The hit squad goons won’t have DEA training.

      Lucy

      October 31, 2013 at 11:23 am

  50. well i thought id drink 5l of cider and go sign on the day after and had no problem so wtf are the jcp smoking i duno but i want some lol but cant afford it and the g4s guard looked pissed today.

    put in complaint about g4s staff telling me im pissed on mouth wash and to leave the building even after i showed them my sick note the twits seems you cant drink alcohol if ur unemployed wtf dont say in my jsa i cant drink lol, id get pissed on my moth wash but its 6 quid for a small bottle:)

    finished with hit squad adviser and back to seeing random ones 1 time a week so back to the start again and now logged a complaint of fraud with ld regarding my ref fee and being parked for the hole 2 years and no exit report and have now got a ref number for it so the jcp cant send me on anything they have on offer until it is resolved.

    super ted

    October 29, 2013 at 5:00 pm

    • “well i thought id drink 5l of cider and go sign on the day after…”

      Thought you were on medication, Super Ted!

      Lumpenprole

      October 29, 2013 at 9:03 pm

  51. Thought you were on medication, Super Ted!

    it was to prove a point as is jcp/g4s staff can not dictate to me that i am not allowed to drink or smell of alcohol end of because i am unemployed and there is no law to uphold that fact as i could have been to a pub for an interview quick half pint for my dinner and spilled some on me ect and then i would not be allowed to go in the jcp because i smell of booze and the phone call to rearrange my signing was 6 quid on a mobile sat outside the jcp as they would not let me use the phones inside as i was pissed on mouth wash.

    super ted

    October 29, 2013 at 9:34 pm

    • They are now asking Jobseekers to attend in a presentable condition to sign on in order to present a businesslike image and prepare us for the world of work.

      I’m sorry, but seriously, how many jobs do they advertise at JCP that require smart dress? A guy got a grilling yesterday from the advisor for turning up for a 5 minute appointment in jeans. They will have a brass sign on the door soon. “MEMBERS ONLY”

      Chris

      October 30, 2013 at 9:07 am

      • You could see that one coming though, jobseekers will be expected to turn up in a hand-knitted bespoke cashmere suit just to receive their miserly pittance of a subsistence allowance.

        Skinty

        October 30, 2013 at 9:21 am

      • And look at the scruffy way the jobcentre staff dress and that is the front-line staff. I reckon the ‘decision makers’ are sat in some back room in their dressing down and slippers.

        Skinty

        October 30, 2013 at 9:23 am

      • Chris:

        The accepted given for attending the Jobcentre is: Just to be reasonably clean and tidy, also to be clean shaven. Jeans are perfectly fine as long as your balls and bums not hanging out!

        Obi Wan Kenobi

        October 30, 2013 at 9:24 am

      • This guy was clean and tidy. I did notice that there seemed to be a lot less track suits in there yesterday though. Perhaps these interview skills classes they’re holding in the back room are setting dress standards.

        Maybe the dress code for litter picking on MWA will be Top hat and tails?

        Chris

        October 30, 2013 at 9:43 am

      • Is this for real Chris as under their rules their not allowed to comment on your appearance and hygiene.

        gaia

        October 30, 2013 at 2:31 pm

      • Yeah. The advisor asked the guy whether he thought jeans and a polo shirt were suitable for job seeking.

        They’re getting fussy with everything. Turn your phone off in rhere

        Chris

        November 2, 2013 at 12:51 am

      • Turn your phone off in there, they even have a sign telling people to be quiet in the waiting area. Mind u the sofa is only about 10 feel away from rife advisors swags

        Chris

        November 2, 2013 at 12:58 am

  52. Iain Duncan Smith has lost the DWP appeal in the Supreme Court regarding the Workfare Schemes.

    Obi Wan Kenobi

    October 30, 2013 at 10:00 am

    • Its great when things go in our favor i am on cloud nine for now. Time for IDS to go.

      ED

      October 30, 2013 at 10:16 am

    • Excellent news.. Now it should be his turn to be put on the Work Programme for 2 years 😉

      Chris

      October 30, 2013 at 10:29 am

    • Not according to DWP spokesmen or should I say woman, notice how IDS is NOWHERE TO BE SEEN TODAY ?

      gaia

      October 30, 2013 at 2:34 pm

  53. Bad day for IDS – AND ABOUT TIME TOO!

    Now we will have to wait to see if anyone who has done an MWA or other Workfare Scheme will be compensated for the time they worked on them – if so this should be paid at the new National Minimum Wage rate of £6.31p per hour and because we had to do them under sanction threat, we shouldn’t have any tax to pay on any payout.

    Obi Wan Kenobi

    October 30, 2013 at 10:28 am

  54. Anyone on the Work Programme, who were mandated under the old regulations should have a claim against any sanctions implied because the regs are unlawful. Anyone on any of these schemes could walk out now and there would be no come back. ( i think )

    ED

    October 30, 2013 at 11:05 am

  55. “6 month Community Workfare: Commercial competition opens for business.”

    Well, that’s not going to happen now because it comes under the old 2011 JSA rules and regs for Workfare which has just been judged Illegal – it used to be The Community Action Progamme (C.A.P.) – how ever when IDS changed the law retrospectivley (earlier this year), he didn’t include this scheme.

    Obi Wan Kenobi

    October 30, 2013 at 11:12 am

    • Indeed Obi Wan on the last part so we will all just have to see what grows from it in time.

      What amazes me about this work for benefit is that the government yet again are going to hand it out to the very same companies that failed to produce any results last time around with MWA and FND/WORK PROGRAMME BE IT UNDER LABOUR OR CONSERVATIVES.

      None of these politicians would hire again a bad plumber if it were in their homes so it begs the question DOES IT NOT ?

      gaia

      October 30, 2013 at 2:42 pm

      • AH But!

        To them the Work Programme was not a failure. they just needed more time. even if they could not hit any of their MIN targets. They were given more time and still could not hit the MIN targets issued by the DWP ( i think about 5%) but the extra time proved that they had increased dramatically on their first targets. So it was a success.Even though they again failed to hit the MIN target.
        The WP now request more money to help them obtain their MIN requirements from DWP. ( the contracts say they should be sacked) but as the DWP now think it was a huge success( over time) IDS still think it was a great result.

        The facts are the WP.

        Failed in the first year. ( and requested more time )
        Failed in the second year ( but had improvements due to IDS fake stats) and not hit MIN targets again, so requested more money.

        Time might make people forget but the facts are there.

        They failed to meet MIN targets from DWP and there contract should be removed.

        ED

        October 30, 2013 at 3:12 pm

      • And how can it when its just using the same principles as those that passed under labour. Theirs absolutely no way on this earth that the government cant know this even if lying to the public so their must be a win win in it for them, the question is what, why use a well tried and failed system, why when knowing this are they proceeding to lengthen it ?

        gaia

        October 30, 2013 at 5:05 pm

    • It will be interesting to see what the Chancellor has to say about this in his Autumn Statement on December 4 when he said he was going to announce more details about 6 month workfare.

      jj joop

      October 30, 2013 at 5:26 pm

  56. gaia :
    And how can it when its just using the same principles as those that passed under labour. Theirs absolutely no way on this earth that the government cant know this even if lying to the public so their must be a win win in it for them, the question is what, why use a well tried and failed system, why when knowing this are they proceeding to lengthen it ?

    May be they didn’t expect to lose this case!

    jj joop

    October 30, 2013 at 5:27 pm

    • Losing the case doesn’t mean anything as Growl points out as they did already re draft it to allow it to continue after the first court case failed to rule in their favour.

      Rather than debate it I strongly suggest people read my post on why it doesn’t constitute as forced labour – October 26, 2013 at 9:00 am | #11 above, then research it carefully.

      Their is a case to argue previously (im not suggesting right or wrong) BUT claimants need to concentrate on this upcoming 6 month one in terms of sticking with the rules.

      Do remember everyone that a country breaking a EU rule only ends in fines and is often excepted by a country that wishes to act draconian.

      A case in point is that previously each year (not sure if law has now changed) the UK government irrespective of the party running it had in the past paid a fine every year just so they can keep up a certain type of razor wire fencing (nickname cheese wire on account of how you end up after contact) they place on prisons. The UK is not alone in this practice of ignoring rules by just paying the fine.

      If your interested in such things up until a short while ago despite not having their own DEATH PENALTY, the UK actually made and distributed the lethal injection cocktail administered to global death row inmates.

      SO violating your human rights/civil liberties isn’t going to be a problem for UK government, well unless you can get at the very least 20 times the figure claiming unemployment regardless of benefit to stand up and demand action and accountability.

      I know this is cruel but you all need to wake up to reality as this has nothing to do with picking on you as they don’t even notice you exist beyond a stat, nor care. We are all just victims to power play and what starts with us ends up effecting the entire country.

      Do you not see how this is shaping up, how government is merely pathing the bottom of the ladder for servitude, how the middle class is disappearing every day bringing out a clear divide between rich and poor.

      Are you aware the trigger that caused the global crash is still in play and can happen again at any second and will in time.

      When people cut back on expense the price gets driven higher, when the public cant afford to buy, the companies cant afford wages, do you see where this is going ?

      gaia

      October 31, 2013 at 8:23 am

  57. I dont see that she won on anything useful point all , they have all ready shown that they are willing to backdate the law and they will just do the same thing again on the notification.

    Neither that or the ‘slave’ labour point will be settled unless it goes to the European cOurts

    growls

    October 30, 2013 at 6:40 pm

  58. gaia :
    And how can it when its just using the same principles as those that passed under labour. Theirs absolutely no way on this earth that the government cant know this even if lying to the public so their must be a win win in it for them, the question is what, why use a well tried and failed system, why when knowing this are they proceeding to lengthen it ?

    Because if it continues IDS will look like a tit again and he can’t have that.

    So he will just spend more tax payers money. Not like its his!!!

    ED

    October 30, 2013 at 10:06 pm

  59. It grieves me to think how many full time jobs could have been created with the billions that have been languished on this failure of a programme since its introduction. The same could be said about the cost of ATOS appeals, court cases and the resto of the hair brained schemes designed to humiliate and belittle the unemployed that consecutive governments dream up.

    The cost of the £5billion budget that was initially allocated for the WP alone could have been used to create jobs. Ok, minimum wage is crap, but its gotta be a lot better than £71 a week pittance that is being dished out now. Hardly anyone except the private providers have benefitted from the work programme in the 2 and a half years it’s been running. With potentially hundreds of applicants chasing each job it was never going to work as not all advertised posts are genuine with agencies bombarding UJM and job search sites with spam.

    chris

    October 31, 2013 at 10:30 am

    • Could not agree more.

      But the poverty ponces would have us believe they are ‘helping’ us.

      Andrew Coates

      October 31, 2013 at 2:12 pm

    • Its like the healthcare reform and education, your government is trying to create a consumer mentality around welfare.

      If you really want to be creeped out then start following American politics as every thing that the conservatives do, the Americans have already done and far worse.

      In the states (not sure if its every state though)now before getting welfare the individual must take a drug and alcohol test and get this at their OWN EXPENSE. If it negative for both then you get welfare and a refund on your D and D test.

      Lastly are you aware in the states that it is a federal offence for me to GIVE FOR FREE, you fruit or veg from my own garden and if you think that’s crazy then how about that farmers are not allowed to propagate their own crops.

      gaia

      November 1, 2013 at 1:17 am

  60. At our local JCP it was heaving this morning – the normal signing on advisers are now going through everyones jobsearch with a fine tooth comb, this is taking a lot more time to do and thus others who are there to sign on are being forced to wait until the next adviser is free.

    I arrived 10 mins before my signing time and was waiting nearly 30 mins to actually get signed on – ridiculous!

    Obi Wan Kenobi

    October 31, 2013 at 2:44 pm

    • The advisor I saw on Tuesday said that there is a chance of being recycled on the WP again in the new year. I finished my sentence in July, now they’re saying that it might be a case of attending to do the whole thing again as the JC can’t offer any training. Was told I should consider taking up work on zero hours contracts – although this would probably mean signing on and off on a regular basis (and guessing the delays and waiting days on the claim between being in and out of work)

      chris

      October 31, 2013 at 3:55 pm

      • Yes, Chris, and the first week of the new claim will not be paid (the so-called “wonga week”).

        Surely, you’re more likely to be put on the new Community Work Placement in April 2014 rather than being “recycled” onto the work programme?

        Lumpenprole

        October 31, 2013 at 4:49 pm

    • Then its time for a case of dyslexia Obi Wan but with the ID numbers, well if your not fool enough to be filling out their own produced evidence sheet currently.

      gaia

      November 1, 2013 at 1:23 am

  61. IT’S HALLOWEEN. Time for a good scare at a Jobcentre near you!

    Obi Wan Kenobi

    October 31, 2013 at 2:46 pm

  62. Lumpenprole :
    Yes, Chris, and the first week of the new claim will not be paid (the so-called “wonga week”).
    Surely, you’re more likely to be put on the new Community Work Placement in April
    2014 rather than being “recycled” onto the work programme?

    How long do you have to sign off for to start claim again from day 1, then you will be back on WP after 6 months, and avoid hit squads and community service, it used to be 13 weeks

    marky

    October 31, 2013 at 6:41 pm

    • The WP is a 2 year programme so I’m guessing that you’d probably end up back there if you were still on ‘parole’ for good behaviour (bagging a short term job). JC sent me back to the WP provider to finish the last 2 months (2 interviews) when I restarted my claim. I think that it may be 6 months now though before you can start from scratch – I did just under that before my last job came to an end and JC just put me through as a rapid reclaim. I was back at the WP’s premises within 2 weeks of making the call to reclaim.

      chris

      October 31, 2013 at 7:17 pm

      • Actually that’s not that far fetched from what I hear as after all they will be the ones doing this work for benefit and considering they have the space and PC resource assets it makes sense they will do this 35 hour jobsearch to.

        gaia

        November 1, 2013 at 1:39 am

      • CHRIS
        I have just gone through some old letters and found one re joining the WP. I joined in June this year. My letter says that I will be required to attend the WP until further notice or until my claim for benefit ends. Should my claim end and I re apply for benefit within two years of benefit ending. I will be required to return to the work programme

        WTF

        November 2, 2013 at 12:40 pm

  63. More bad news for IDS, he deserves it,but so much money wasted by this incompetent idiot

    http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2013/oct/31/universal

    ck

    October 31, 2013 at 10:25 pm

    • Good, as this UC is set to punish anyone drawing these tied benefits by way of sanction which currently the system in place doesn’t except for the UNEMPLOYED.

      Imagine this, you work 20 odd hours a week national min but as its not tax deductible for PAYE employees your travel cost soak up your wages so you have to go to the government for help as a low earner. Naturally as its 20 you cant claim unemployment benefit so you claim housing but as you did your now told you must volunteer to make up to the 35 hours and job search ontop.

      What was i saying about servitude.

      gaia

      November 1, 2013 at 1:53 am

      • Always wondered why there were people doing part time jobs and attending the WP.

        Chris

        November 1, 2013 at 3:37 pm

      • As it stands Chris, currently sanctions only apply to people claiming unemployment and in the case of these part time workers attending WP, that’s only so if under 16 hours.

        Personally unless they didn’t quite cancel out their JSA/ESA payment (£71), they didn’t need to as what can DWP sanction when they actually earn this £71 plus £5.

        Basically the first £5 you earn is yours then every penny their after,pound for pound gets deducted from your benefit (£71).

        This is why the Tories want UC desperately as currently I can do this and claim housing and council tax relief for ever without fear of sanctions. It might also be one of the reasons why this government doesn’t want to link min wage to work for benefit, who knows ?

        gaia

        November 2, 2013 at 3:01 am

  64. Just a up date

    Benefit Sanctions Must Be Stopped Without Exceptions in UK?
    Petition Calling For Benefit Sanctions To Be Scrapped Hits 5573 Signatures In First Few days
    http://you.38degrees.org.uk/petitions/benefit-sanctions-must-be-stopped-without-exceptions-in-uk

    ED

    November 1, 2013 at 11:16 am

  65. The only things that seem to be on offer or readily available from the JC at the moment are CV writing, interview techniques and bullying. I have an interview on Wednesday, it’s only for temporary work but it’s hopefully going to be a break from the JC. It’s hard to get a straight answer from any advisor there as each time you see them they will tell you something entirely different.

    With being on ESA they are pretty limited under the law with what they can force me to do unless they decide to change the law. As far as WP is concerned, JC are just saying that on ESA there is a possibility of being returned to WP.

    I was found UNFIT for work by ATOS (company used them to do a medical) a week before Christmas 2010, then miraculously recovered by 26th January 2011 when DWP were paying for the medical at the same premises!

    chris

    November 2, 2013 at 4:52 pm

    • Love it Chris, that last paragraph kills them on that subject.

      Don’t forget that they will likely ask for a CV upfront (usual practice) but this will not go direct to employer so kindly refuse but state instead your quite happy to send it to the employer direct and can you have their address in that case (Do put DPA on your CV always as this prevents the employer discussing it with DWP or should I say they cant use it against you as they would have obtained such information fraudulently not to mention this puts the employer in breach of DPA which is an offence).

      If they become difficult (who we kidding IF) state its so you can BETTER AND MORE EFFCIENTLY control the flow of your said personal and or sensitive data as is your right both reasonably and legally under law (DATA PROTECTION ACT).

      It might be as posted on the latest post to this site (Remember, Remember the 5th of November posted by Job the seeker ) a CON to get your personal and or sensitive data and any information they might be able to use against you.

      I state this as they offered me a maintenance type/handyman placement which what with me being a multi skilled engineer I jumped at. I fear the reaction they got was not what they expected and they withdrew it on the day and didn’t mention it again, even when I kept asking about it week in, week out. During this they tried to scam me into sending by CV to a group that they refused to name rather than to the employer. They tried all this vetting nonsense explanation and how they would need to see how I perform in an interview to justify it but I said flatout NO, I will only send it to the employer. They said they would need to discuss this with management but regardless as I knew I was in the right anyway never came back with a damn thing and when I complained they didn’t even have the stones to apologise for trying to lie to me.

      Hope it all works out the way you want it to Chris as their mission statement clearly says their ,their to help you into work, not hinder you.

      gaia

      November 4, 2013 at 7:39 am

      • and any information they might be able to use against you. , that really should be in bold, gaia because it is really, really important. These c!”£$S are NOT your friends, they are working to your own agenda. ‘CVs’ are nothing but a ‘data harvesting’ exercise and once you surrender your personal information it becomes harder to ‘un-surrender’ it, You never know who it will be ‘shared’ with further down the line and for what purpose. Keep your cards very close to your chest and NEVER volunteer anything!

        DPA

        November 4, 2013 at 9:30 am

      • *working to their own agenda

        DPA

        November 4, 2013 at 9:31 am

      • Whats the point DPA, most claimants have no idea what DPA is let alone how to use it. They throw their personal and sensitive data around like confetti never knowing, never caring.

        You reap what you sow and sadly BOY ARE DWP REAPING, especially now with this UJ so imagine what its going to be like when UC is ready and rolling as you cant discuss your legal controls their first either.

        gaia

        November 5, 2013 at 9:32 am

      • I landed a job, or at least so I thought. Started Wednesday night, got home Thursday morning at 7am. Went back to work at 7pm to find that my name wasn’t on the list to work that night. Not even the decency to give me a 10 second call to let me know before travelling for an hour.

        Agency just said that they will contact me as and when. Good job I never got round to signing off.

        This was a long term post from the UJM website.

        Chris

        November 10, 2013 at 2:08 pm

      • @ Chris
        Never trust a recruitment agency.

        Lumpenprole

        November 10, 2013 at 4:19 pm

      • I’m tempted to call them tomorrow and tell em to find another mug to mess about. You have to be careful with regards the JC though. You tell an agency where to stick it for messing u about and JC would probably say u have deliberately hindered your chances of finding work (that never existed anyway).

        Chris

        November 10, 2013 at 5:36 pm

  66. [Help to Work] 6 month Community Workfare: Commercial competition opens for business.

    http://refuted.org.uk/2013/10/24/workfarecompetition/

    Obi Wan Kenobi

    November 4, 2013 at 3:04 pm

  67. the jcp where i am will only pay 25p per mile fuel allowance so dont cover the cost of the bus fair and have to wait 3 working days for it to go in to my account

    super ted

    November 4, 2013 at 3:28 pm

  68. For ”Gaia” There will soon be a campaign FOR the LIVING WAGE. That’s 8.50 an hour in London 7.50 everywhere else.
    Someone somewhere is bound to start a campaign for a LIVING WAGE of 10.00 an hour

    Boris The Banker

    November 5, 2013 at 10:39 am

    • You mean the new desired min wage and out of interest when people grow tired of that title what ever will we call it next. No offence Boris but this and the nat min are nothing more than smoke and mirrors in reality, their nothing more than a base to start from so as to avoid confrontation with the system that is money. You see like other things in our economy their in relation to another set of figures which in the cold light of day means that if we get paid 7 now and say 10 in five years, all that’s happened is that what only once took 7 now takes 10, meaning one equals the other. In actuality only whats above and beyond is in the real sense a true increase.

      This said although it strikes a cord for the individual it does nothing for money overall which is the real problem as each and every increment no matter what for like the price of coal for instance or the depletion of mineral assets, adds minus value to the current pound, the yen, the dollar and so forth, meaning we will always need more to make it the same as it was.

      Money is an outdated concept that’s reached its expiry point and its only reason to stay is in mans insistence to cultivate greed and the desire to control.

      gaia

      November 5, 2013 at 1:28 pm

      • This inflation/got to fight for more ‘money’ to keep up is not new, it has been going for like even… even my great-great-grandfather was out on strike for ‘money’ because ‘the cost of living’: “20 shillings for a loaf!!” had been going up.

        Sponge Pudding

        November 10, 2013 at 2:40 pm

  69. FOR GAIA
    There will soon be a campaign for the living wage to be manatory

    Boris The Banker

    November 5, 2013 at 10:41 am

  70. Burn down the jobcentre, hang the fucking adviser
    Because the sanctions that they constantly issue
    Keep fucking up my life
    Hang the fucking adviser
    Because the sanctions that they constantly issue….

    The Smiths (Reformed)

    November 7, 2013 at 12:31 am


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